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My low interwinding capacitance coil for CHANCE PI and CLONE PI

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  • My low interwinding capacitance coil for CHANCE PI and CLONE PI

    Hi everyone,
    i would like to share my coil building process which result to a very light coil.
    For this, i used 3mm foam, a small piece of 10mm foam or plastic for the fixing harms.
    So, the fist step is to draw 3 circles on the foam (2 of the same size and one 10mm les in outer diameter an 10mm mor in inner diameter).
    Click image for larger version

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    Then, you have to cut the three circles
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    You can now cut 37 notchs on the inner circle and 37 on the outer (to calculate the space between 2 marks : d=(3.14148Xdiameter)/37
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    Now, it's time to wind the coil. My first one was bad cause i did not find any explanation on this. I'll to explain it in english : if you wind all the turns in the same way, you won't have the same result as expected. When you finish a turn (i mean, just before your wire goes into your first mark), you have to shift the winding of one mark.
    Click image for larger version

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    When the winding is done, you should have 6 layers in each notch.
    You are now ready for the assembly. You'l need epoxy glue, plastic screws, coaxial wire, jointing compound and for the finish, epoxy paint and spray black paint.

    I first make the top layer, assemble and solder the cable
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    Then, i glued the three parts together :
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    Now, it's time for the jointing work. I use aeronautical compound use in planes fuel tanks but you can put watever you want (just carefull of the painting capability).
    In order to make my coil lighter, i use just a small layer of compound by putting a foam stripe all around the exterior and the interior (the exterior one have to be glued in place.

    The finishing of my coil consist of 5 layers of epoxy paint (aeronautical paint of course)
    Click image for larger version

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    and, to finish, black spray paint
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    Her is the whole detector :
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    My coil has an exterior diameter of 23cm, 1.1ohm and 318µH.
    The delay is short int clone menu (about 5 to 8µs).

    Regards

  • #2
    I made a coil like this today and im impress when i roughly hook it up to my pi but after i wrap the coil with electrical tape twice and followed by wrapping of mesh tape and i apply polyurethane resin to harden it up.. Im disappointed after i finish the coil it really cut off the depth of detection up to 40%..

    Comment


    • #3
      Please read the Chance PI Coil thread that thoroughly documents how to build this coil for best performance. No shield mesh is needed and will destroy the coil speed and sensitivity by adding unnecessary capacitance. Also wrapping tightly with tape will crush the spacing out of the coil and destroy its speed by increasing the capacitance.

      Regards,

      Dan

      Comment


      • #4
        This coil is low capacitance o air but high capacitance to ground. Horizontal winding means all turns are close to the ground.

        The same winding technique can be applied to a vertical winding, in this case the average distance of each turn to the ground larger which gives less ground capacitance effect.

        By the way, how do you make the casing and the hook to attach the stick?

        Comment


        • #5
          3DSS Coil Construction Explanation

          Hi Teleno,

          The easiest durable method for bridging the 3DSS is using fiberglass to provide a surface for the mounting tabs or lugs. The mounting tabs can also be formed out of fiberglass. However, I use heat formed LEXAN as the core for the bridge and tabs and then cement the tabs to the bridge. This assembly is attached to the already fiberglassed coil with polyester lacing before fiberglassing. All of this is photo documented and described in the Chance PI Coil thread on the last few pages of its postings.

          By the way I am thinking of making a vertical coil with this same 3DSS winding pattern to see how it performs. While the horizontal coil windings are low capacitance in air, and near the ground they are unavoidably higher capacitance, it is not nearly as high of capacitance as a bunch, spider, basket, or spiral wound coil with the required separate shield. My 328uh coil runs quiet set at 7us sample delay over damp soil with only the occasional beep that is not repeatable like a true target does. It is completely usable in its present form. Still I am interested in how the vertical 3DSS wind will perform. I already have the vertical coil form specs designed and the insulated PTFE wire has arrived. It should be interesting.

          Regards,

          Dan

          Comment


          • #6
            Can you please show me what it see's on Natural Gold of say .1 Grams ?

            Comment


            • #7
              guys, I AGAIN WRITE TO YOU. do not fill a coil by epoxy -! you must cover the winding by scotch tape (+rape), getting fat layer,
              and only AFTER that to fill by epoxy. winding has to be left IN AIR (HANG UP IN AIR).

              ARE YOU ABLE TO GRASP THAT??? what so difficult for you to grasp that???

              Comment


              • #8
                I don't fill or flood it with any resin of any kind because that will ruin it. If you read my construction description in the Chance PI Coil thread you will see what I do to preserve the windings in air with only a fiberglass shell around the coil for protection.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by homefire View Post
                  Can you please show me what it see's on Natural Gold of say .1 Grams ?
                  ----------
                  Wow only .1 gram or in other words 1.54 grains! That is a very small target but in post 201 of the Chance PI Coil thread I did have this test in air:



                  Just wound a new oval 'Racetrack' spider coil 4" x 12.5" with 8.5" parallel sides using 24 AWG 600 volt PTFE/Teflon wire on a .093" thick LEXAN form. It measures 325uh with the coil and 35" feedline attached SRF is 1.070 mHz. On my CHANCE PI with 2 stage preamp it detects the following targets (in air) repeatably at the distances shown:


                  TARGET---------------------SOLID TONE DISTANCE---------------------1ST DETECTION DISTANCE

                  Aluminum pop can---------18" end on 20" broadside-------------------23"

                  1" X 1" AL soda can -------11"-------------------------------------------12.75"

                  8.6 grain dental gold-------2.75"-----------------------------------------4.5"

                  1/4" X 1/4" AL soda can---1.75"------------------------------------------3.0"

                  Gold placer flakes----------0.75"-----------------------------------------1.125" Note: Gold flakes in glass vial - largest piece is .95 grain, 2 pieces - .19 grain, 1 piece - .12 grain, 1 piece - .11 grain. Total weight of all dust and flakes 2.92 grains. With the flakes loose in a glass vial it is hard to present the target consistently to the coil as the pieces can shift or be on edge.

                  Dan

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by baum7154 View Post
                    I don't fill or flood it with any resin of any kind because that will ruin it. If you read my construction description in the Chance PI Coil thread you will see what I do to preserve the windings in air with only a fiberglass shell around the coil for protection.
                    kt415 is UNABLE TO GRASP THAT, among a lot of other stuff.

                    What's the peak current at the coil of the Chance PI? What's the battery voltage?

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by Teleno View Post
                      kt415 is UNABLE TO GRASP THAT, among a lot of other stuff.

                      What's the peak current at the coil of the Chance PI? What's the battery voltage?
                      `````````````````````````

                      The system voltage is 12.5VDC.

                      The peak coil current is a bit more complex because the transmit pulse is comprised of a 16 pulse burst with active shorting of the coil using a mosfet during the pause, to pump up the coil. The first pulse is about 10us with a 30us pause. Each successive pulse is incrementally longer ending with the last pulse being about 40us, and then flyback. All pulses are allocated 40us including the pause. If we assume that the average pulse is 25us that may be an usable number. The coil is about 1.7 ohms and the 9640 misfit is 0.5 ohm. Note this is the timing for the original clocking of the Chance. I have increased clocking by 23% so the timings are now shorter.

                      Dan

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by baum7154 View Post
                        The peak coil current is a bit more complex because the transmit pulse is comprised of a 16 pulse burst with active shorting of the coil using a mosfet during the pause, to pump up the coil.
                        Loks like recirculation for saving energy during a long Tx period.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          I just made 3 coil for comparison with the same inductance, wire diameter and coil diameter..the 3dss type has doubled the capacitance compare to spider wave and flat spiral coil..

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            i got best results with flat spiral and litz wire with a good thick isolation

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Hi bernte_one! Does your coil shielded or not during testing?

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