PCB Layout Programs

[Tepco]

Possible problem. Protel (PCB part) must be initially “cracked” and enabled, S/N free in original installation and then transferred to another OS, crack file can be deleted. PCB part is only weakly protected, in schematic part reentering S\N and registration manually from old installation is needed. I don't have access codes at hand right now, but will post if needed. Also, under Wine loader, it is possible to run “crkprt” file if you have it, to unlock all features. Barely legal post...

[ODM]

I personally use EAGLE for the price point, the free version producing limited size boards but having the option of adding/creating component libraries. I've also seen it in professional use by the German aerospace center, but what do they know?

At work I use PADS though, and find its automation a lot more capable. From what I know, there are better autoplace/routers still - starting at prices of tens of thousands of euros per license. Autorouters can lead one into poor design practices, it's often better to manually route the board as electrical rule check makes routing quick.

For stolen stuff, the price point is moot, of course! Hard to compete with that

As for user interfaces, I think every company has their own approach. Haven't seen two cad programs that would be similar enough, unless made by the same company. The same thing goes for mechanics design software as well.

[Carl-NC]

PtB, are you now using Altium or still on Protel?

[mykaitch]

Ah, well now you've got me. I have the full version (99SE) that does Spice emulation, FPGA and all sorts of stuff. No, it is well outside us home-brewers, last licence cost around 5k I believe. Of course, there is a rumour that it can be downloaded on the web as a fully featured 60 day trial and that elesewhere on the web, so it is said in the dark corners of dusty back rooms, a patch can be obtained to stop the 60 day clock - this is all rumour and fantasy of course and very illegal I would think. My room is not very dark or dusty, now. In the real world, I think we can discount Eagle and Proteus, but there are so many GOOD alternatives, some even free. It may take a few try-outs to find one you like, but worth the effort in the end. ViewTraks I have been told is good.

[mykaitch]

Psst...keep legal. Email me direct [email protected] no more, nudge nudge.

[Tinkerer]

http://www.designspark.com/page/desi...-pcb-home-page

I am quite happy using DESIGNSPARK. As a fact, I am just now going to download the latest version, 4.

[mykaitch]

Another good one then. I am not trying to 'sell' Protel, I was just joining the thread and finding people to share my Eagle/Ptoteus joy. Many, many good (and often free) packages out there.

[der_fisherman]

Picking out a good Schematic and PCB CAD.

I haven't used DesignSpark yet, but from the documentation it would appear to be CAD that accepts Schematics, which I feel is a very important feature. Does it update the PCB when a change is made to the schematic?
It does appear to only use RS components (please correct me if I am wrong on that point), which may or may not be a problem, only time will tell.....
I guess I will have to find something to key in and see how I get on.
First appearances are very good.
Thanks for posting the link.
Regards
Andy

[porkluvr]

I tried to master Protel 99SE about >10 years ago. One bad thing about Protel was that if you dragged schematic blocks and weren't careful to make sure that wires did not cross where they had not crossed before, you would get unintended new connections. I would see new connection dots, if I was paying attention. If I wasn't paying attention, well it would be buggered but I just wouldn't know about it...

Another thing that drove me crazy was that in library editor I found it extremely difficult to keep what should be solid lines from breaking into little segments that needed to be moved individually.

These same problems have carried forward and are present in Altium, last I checked.

But I was very amazed one day when I got the Protel simulator to run a four opamp audio compressor circuit I had drawn. Big whoopee.

[Tinkerer]

I haven't used DesignSpark yet, but from the documentation it would appear to be CAD that accepts Schematics, which I feel is a very important feature. Does it update the PCB when a change is made to the schematic?
It does appear to only use RS components (please correct me if I am wrong on that point), which may or may not be a problem, only time will tell.....
I guess I will have to find something to key in and see how I get on.
First appearances are very good.
Thanks for posting the link.
Regards
Andy

Designspark comes with a part inventory of about 80,000 parts. There is a feature to access RS components with the BOM, I have not tried it.
No problems designing your own parts if you can not find an equivalent part within the 80,000. Just re-name a part with similar features for different manufacturer.

Draw your schematic, transform to PCB and to 3D very simple. Any changes update.

I started with version 1, now at version 4, only getting better. Never any hassle.

It took me a bit of time to find the right parts in that immense part inventory.

It can use LTSpice simulations, I have not tried that yet.

Many more features that I have not tried yet.

All the best

Tinkerer

[IBGold]

Hi Tinkerer,

As you know I have been using Designspark for a while now to do our PCB's but I am trying to import an Eagle design file for a Chipkit UNO32 shield to make up an interface board for our project have you had any experience in doing that it is supposed to work but does not seem to work for me Hi.

Regards, Ian.

[Tinkerer]

Hi Tinkerer,

As you know I have been using Designspark for a while now to do our PCB's but I am trying to import an Eagle design file for a Chipkit UNO32 shield to make up an interface board for our project have you had any experience in doing that it is supposed to work but does not seem to work for me Hi.

Regards, Ian.

Hi Ian,

I have never used this feature yet. Below are the instructions from the Designspark #4 help file.
Good luck.


Importing Eagle Files

When importing schematic or PCB designs:
Main MenuFileOpen

Shortcut Key: Control+O

Toolbar:

When importing libraries:
Main MenuFileLibraries

Shortcut Key: Control+L

Toolbar:

Eagle PCB and Schematic designs, Part, Footprint and Schematic Symbol libraries can be transferred to DesignSpark PCB.

[Pete the Builder]

PtB, are you now using Altium or still on Protel?

Carl, I'm using Altium for my current designs, but I also have a few working copies of Protel running in virtual machines on my main system. I also have the install floppies. Yeah, I'm a magpie - can't chuck anything away.

Cheers,
PtB

[Pete the Builder]

Another spoon in the pot...

I'm currently downloading an interesting package called Fritzing. It seems to be trying to be an end-to-end solution, from schematic to PCB prototyping with their own PCB service. I'll post an update when I've had a better look at the real thing.
-PtB

[Pete the Builder]

Here's an update on Fritzig.

This is a really interesting idea. You basically see either a breadboard, schematic, or PCB. In breadboard mode, you can place components (not a huge variety, as this seems squarely aimed at the Arduino market), wire them together, then switch to schematic view, and there are all your components with nets linking the pins!

The opposite is true, too - you can start off with a blank schematic, draw your circuit, then switch to breadboard view, and voilá : there are all your parts, ready for you to place and wire up!

And PCB view is the same - you can even start off with parts on the PCB and just wire them up any old way!

Unfortunately, all three modes are linked - so if you accidentally place a component in the wrong breadboard place, the router/net handler immediately updates the schematic and PCB - and vice versa!

There is a rudimentary autorouter, it actually works, but is obviously a work in progress.

The breadboard view allows you to click on component pins or breadboard rows, and see the selected net as highlighted rows, which is pretty darn sweet. You can also add more "virtual breadboard" for the larger designs, but I didn't test this.

Oh, what a tangled web we weave!

The best part of this (beta) is that it does everything you would expect a breadboard-to-PCB router to do, and it's certainly no worse than Eagle or Protel to learn!

If you're in the mood to waste an hour or so, go get it, from http://fritzig.org It's free as in beer, and a hell of a lot of fun to play with. I immediately started playing around adding components (which can apparently be shared worldwide if you wish), but the part editor is, well, not much chop.

The potential of this as an introduction to circuit design is incredible. Even stale old pros like us could lash up a circuit without thinking. Great for trial sizing, draft layouts, all sorts of things.

It's pretty busted right now, it is a beta release after all, but as I said, the potential is there, and it would be hard to have more fun sitting at the computer. Hell, I got my design eventually laid out, and it looked almost as good routed as it did on Altium!

I guess if you have kids interested in the Arduino style of design, this would be a perfect fit. For us, it's probably underkill, but could be useful.

Well, that was a fun hour and a half!

Cheers,
PtB

This is how it starts up with a few components scattered around the little breadboard.


The schematic editor :


The breadboard highlighty thing :


And (tadaa!) the freshly autorouted PCB!