Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

Experimenting with the vmh3cs transmitter

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • Experimenting with the vmh3cs transmitter

    Based on JL Kings valuable observations and simulation schematics. Found here post #1479.

    https://www.geotech1.com/forums/show...etector/page60

    I was able to develop some working circuits. The gate drive transformers and power supply are the biggest challenge. Like the Johnson regenerative half bridge Tx, the vmh3cs generates its own virtual ground at 1/2 vcc. The virtual (Tx) ground is delicately balanced and will not handle additional loads. So the system ground needs to be buffered and referenced to Tx ground or 1/2 vcc. The gate drive transformers are a study in themselves. These provide isolation, level shifting along with a boosted gate drive voltage. This allows the use of high side n-ch mosfets. The best cores I tested were made by Magnetics Inc. "Square Permalloy" material code D. These exhibit a square B-H curve. Fourteen turns trifilar magnet wire, one wire as primary and the other two connected as a center tapped secondary with a 1:2 turns ratio. These cores are rare, large and expensive. I had a variety from past projects to test. Next I tried surface mount gate drive transformers from Coilcraft, these failed as they are low inductance, low volts/us product. They are meant to be used in pwm drives with middle range duty cycles or line drivers for data communications. For experimenting I found common mode choke cores to be economic and available. I ordered a variety of "common mode choke toroids" from ebay. They come bifilar wound and are used in switch mode power supplies as filters. You can get 10 for under $2. The same core can be bought without windings. The permeability is on the high side, but they work and are easy add or remove turns. No specs are available for the original vmh3cs core or the ebay core. One comparison is the vmh3 core measured about 12uh/turn while the green cores have about 100uH/t. When the next pcbs come in I'm going to tweak the turns for best performance. Also need to test these core for saturation. In general cores should be a "soft ferrite" with a permeability around 2000.

    The attached scope shots are - green trace equals coil voltage, yellow equals current across a 0.5 ohm resistor. At turn on, over 200 volts is discharged into the tx coil. In a few uS the current is almost a constant 2 amps. The active damping is the key to the vmh3. Tests without active damping showed a fast coil (340uh 0.6r) generated 260vpp 1 amp and a slow (1500uh 3r) coil produced about 115vpp and less than one amp. Active damping applied at the right time during flyback caused a huge increase in current and voltage for fast and slow coils. For fast coils the damping must be applied earlier. The slow coil damped at 5us created a coil voltage of 800vpp, in other words the high and low side mosfets were in avalanche. I added a 240v snubber to limit the vpp to 480v. Also reducing the supply voltage can control the output. Reading the Vallon patent, they monitor the coil current to control the peak output. The timing for the active damping explains why the vmh3cs only likes a small range of coils. A fast coil is already in decay before the damping resistor is connected at 4.5us. Opposite if the damping is activated too soon on a slow coil the fly back gets snubbed before it reaches full potential.

    The circuits were tested with a supply voltage from 12 to 20 volts, supply current spanned 100mA to 350mA depending on the coil specs and applied voltage. Switching logic requires 8 I/O lines , all switching pulses are 5v, 2us wide. The Tx pulse width was variable 30uS to 100uS.
    Attached Files

  • #2
    more photos
    Attached Files

    Comment


    • #3
      Originally posted by Altra View Post
      ... The best cores I tested were made by Magnetics Inc. "Square Permalloy" material code D...
      I used these to make pulse transformer MOSFET drivers based on the Vallon circuits... The only change is that I use 5V to drive the primary side vs 3.3V in the Vallon.

      https://www.ebay.com/itm/10-Pcs-Toro...EAAOSw2m9ckdLg

      They are 1.2mH balanced chokes. I removed one winding, compressed the remaining winding, and the wound 4 turns of 24 AWG in the blank area (created by compressing the remaining winding). This resulted in a measured 126uH primary and a 1.4mH secondary. A mock up of the MOSFET drive circuit worked perfectly.

      Comment


      • #4
        Thanks for the info, I have those exact chokes. I'm using 5v also to drive the primaries.

        Comment


        • #5
          Originally posted by Altra View Post
          Based on JL Kings valuable observations and simulation schematics. Found here post #1479.

          https://www.geotech1.com/forums/show...etector/page60

          I was able to develop some working circuits.
          Hi Altra, nice work, thanks for sharing

          cheers

          Mdtoday

          Comment


          • #6
            Very nice work.
            What's the point of isolating the gate drive? Does it speed up switch off time? Any literature on this topic?( transformer gate drive)

            Comment


            • #7
              That is the old-school method of driving MOSFETs. It is fast, but lately seldom used because of the transformers. There are high side and low side drivers more commonly used nowadays. I used transformers to drive MOSFETS in a several kW MW AM Tx some 20 years ago. Given choice... I'd avoid them. Life is so much easier without pulse transformers.

              @Altra, in BP Tx pcb1 you have P-channelled MOSFETs indicated as 2N7000 ?!

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by Davor View Post
                That is the old-school method of driving MOSFETs. It is fast, but lately seldom used because of the transformers. There are high side and low side drivers more commonly used nowadays. I used transformers to drive MOSFETS in a several kW MW AM Tx some 20 years ago. Given choice... I'd avoid them. Life is so much easier without pulse transformers...
                Davor is right. I like the UCC23513 myself (using it in progress).

                Comment


                • #9
                  I am well aware of isolated gate drives. Also high/low side drivers such as the IR2104 which rely on the switching signal to boost the gate to source voltage. The IR2153 has an internal oscillator to boost the GS voltage and not rely on the switch voltage. The bottom line is you have to maintain the gate drive at least 6v or higher than the source. When the high side fet is conducting DS voltage equal near zero so you need to drive the gate higher than vcc.

                  In the attached photo is a bipolar pi I built using fod3180

                  Weather old school or not. This bar or non the best PI transmitter I have worked with.
                  Attached Files

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by KingJL View Post
                    Davor is right. I like the UCC23513 myself (using it in progress).
                    I was agreeing with Davor that pulse transformer MOSFET drivers are old school... but they work! Getting the "new school" gate drivers to work in a PI is the problem. I have been working with the UCC23513, but have not yet solved the method for generating the Vcc for the high side of the boosted bi-polar transmitter that does not destroy the coil discharge characteristics needed for PI operation or does not destroy the driven MOSFET itself. Life is so much easier without pulse transformers... but old school pulse transformers do work... and work... and work!

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Frankly... I think this conundrum is easily solvable without transformers. You only have to find P-channel MOSFETs to run the high side (not that big of a deal) and do some mirroring with transistors. Easy-peasy. We are talking about a few amps, not hundreds, so P-channel is not that big sacrifice.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Here's the latest pcb and schematic for the bi-polar transmiter

                        The main changes are to the power supply. It now has a buffered virtual ground that tracks 1/2Vcc. A variable pot was added to adjust Vcc from 12v to 20v. I found the fixed +20v vcc was to aggressive with certain coils, 14 to 15v seems to be ideal for what I'm doing. Other changes - I killed a micro-processor while testing and found a shorted output pin. So I replaced the 47R series resistors with 1K on the logic lines driving the mosfet drivers. These pins can only handle 20ma. The TC4427's make up for any problems the 1K series resistors might contribute. On the pcb I changed the gate transformer foot print to accept the ebay toroids. I ended up using 7 turns #24 magnet wire for the primary and leaving one of the original windings as the secondary which is 12 turns maybe #28?. JLking suggested a 4 turn primary which worked on my first pcb. On this board it had problems on the high side driver. I believe the difference is pcb1 had 1 ohm series resistors on each primary lead. The new pcb these were omitted, so the core were probably saturating? Adding a few turns to the primary solved the problem and am getting full turn on. I found the ebay pre-wound toroids have a wide inductance tolerance. Winding 10 differnt cores with 4 turns #24. The inductance ranged from 129uH to 270uh, with most falling in the 150uH range.
                        Attached Files

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Nice work Altra, thanks for sharing

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Update: Here is a complete bipolar metal detector. It is still a work in progress, but so far I am please with the results. On this version I eliminated the switch mode voltage boost power supply. It was adding some ripple in the preamp output. With the other challenges to over come it was better just to get it out of the way. It can be added back later. The ground balance is simple 10us sample followed by a 0 to 40uS delay(GB adj) then a 30uS gb sample. This was the first one I tried for testing. I'm sure there are many combinations that can work. Without the EF samples it is much easier to balance the ground signal.

                            I can only sample down to 11uS so far using a mono loop. There is some ringing below 11us causing instability and high offsets. The ultimate goal is to use an induction balanced coil. This will allow the rx side to have an isolated vref and eliminate unwanted offsets.

                            Here are a couple of videos one shows the circuit and the other target responses. You can hear some threshold chattering in the video. This can be be improved once I add tx frequency adjust.


                            https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2G_sd5OGoOs



                            https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HKHWsdSx6Bw&t=54s

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by Altra View Post
                              Update: Here is a complete bipolar metal detector. It is still a work in progress, but so far I am please with the results. On this version I eliminated the switch mode voltage boost power supply. It was adding some ripple in the preamp output. With the other challenges to over come it was better just to get it out of the way. It can be added back later. The ground balance is simple 10us sample followed by a 0 to 40uS delay(GB adj) then a 30uS gb sample. This was the first one I tried for testing. I'm sure there are many combinations that can work. Without the EF samples it is much easier to balance the ground signal.

                              I can only sample down to 11uS so far using a mono loop. There is some ringing below 11us causing instability and high offsets. The ultimate goal is to use an induction balanced coil. This will allow the rx side to have an isolated vref and eliminate unwanted offsets.

                              Here are a couple of videos one shows the circuit and the other target responses. You can hear some threshold chattering in the video. This can be be improved once I add tx frequency adjust.


                              https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2G_sd5OGoOs



                              https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HKHWsdSx6Bw&t=54s
                              Great work Altra, well done.

                              Comment

                              Working...
                              X