Nokta Invenio

[Prospekteur]

What do you think about nokta invenio? I think its another simple logger which painting the signals/Audiosignals into an coordinate system. Ive heard it will Ccost about 6000 €. It reminds me on some okm machines. Its not very hard to visualize big objects in your own brain from audiosignals, especially when you detect very slowly. And the guy in this Video detects really slow�� not a spectacular improvement to me.....

https://youtu.be/y6RzhUrQUQQ

[WM6]

How the heck it is not previous patented by minelab?

[goshafad]

Static noise...that seems to be the M/O on this machine on forums. No one willing to invest $6,700 to find out. Perhaps later this year I will.

[ivconic]

Static noise...that seems to be the M/O on this machine on forums. No one willing to invest $6,700 to find out. Perhaps later this year I will.

You are either filthy rich enthusiast... either very brave to risk such money... either something third.
I think we already discussed these kinds of "detectors".
For slightly under $150 a lidar sensor can be purchased and added to just any detector. To track the coil movement in space.
And that's about all.
The "logger" part is straightforward and not so complex to do.
When detection occurs; the "logger" starts logging the "data".
Data consists of lidar data (position in space) and signal strength... and probably disc info (if any).
So the rest of the software draws the "picture" by using those data.
Nice. But i miss to see how it is usable?
On the video the "triangle" is placed so close, so "shallow". Any detector will react the same on it.
Even the most simplest one.
What if the triangle is at 1m depth? "Picture" will not be so clear and obvious.
And just any better detector will locate such large targets even at more than 1m depths.
...
Point is; the "detector" inside is of questionable quality and performances. And that's the essence of what we really want and interested in.
To be able to detect such triangle at least at 1m depths and at the same time to "draw" perfect triangle on the display.
Even that is meaningless and pointless. The "triangle"??? How many targets anybody of us ever discovered with such shape?
Most of us are searching more than that, the coins, jewelry, armory, fortunes of various kinds etc.
And most of us already do have the machines to do such task up to some depths and up to some degree of accuracy.
Most of us do strive for a bit better performances than those we already have with our machines.
So... conslusion, Nokta Invenio is nice toy as an example how to use lidar sensor, but considering it's price; it is total nonsense in a course of real performances and benefits that we the users are striving to.
I would never waste my money on such "endeavours"!

[sinclairuser]

You are either filthy rich enthusiast... either very brave to risk such money... either something third.
I think we already discussed these kinds of "detectors".
For slightly under $150 a lidar sensor can be purchased and added to just any detector. To track the coil movement in space.
And that's about all.
The "logger" part is straightforward and not so complex to do.
When detection occurs; the "logger" starts logging the "data".
Data consists of lidar data (position in space) and signal strength... and probably disc info (if any).
So the rest of the software draws the "picture" by using those data.
Nice. But i miss to see how it is usable?
On the video the "triangle" is placed so close, so "shallow". Any detector will react the same on it.
Even the most simplest one.
What if the triangle is at 1m depth? "Picture" will not be so clear and obvious.
And just any better detector will locate such large targets even at more than 1m depths.
...
Point is; the "detector" inside is of questionable quality and performances. And that's the essence of what we really want and interested in.
To be able to detect such triangle at least at 1m depths and at the same time to "draw" perfect triangle on the display.
Even that is meaningless and pointless. The "triangle"??? How many targets anybody of us ever discovered with such shape?
Most of us are searching more than that, the coins, jewelry, armory, fortunes of various kinds etc.
And most of us already do have the machines to do such task up to some depths and up to some degree of accuracy.
Most of us do strive for a bit better performances than those we already have with our machines.
So... conslusion, Nokta Invenio is nice toy as an example how to use lidar sensor, but considering it's price; it is total nonsense in a course of real performances and benefits that we the users are striving to.
I would never waste my money on such "endeavours"!

well said ivica, thats the most sensible thing i have read about these "detectors".

[Taktyk]

Nokta copied mxt - the X,Y measurement path to ADC is identical. The rest is marketing and lidar sensor. That's it.

[ivconic]

well said ivica, thats the most sensible thing i have read about these "detectors".

Nokta/Makro has come a long way so far with many obstacles in development.
However, in the end, they proved that they are capable of making a good detector (even when all or part of it is copied from an existing one).
I have never been overly critical of such at beginning. If you don't know; then you learn from someone who knows.
If you do not have documentation and data; then you make them yourself by first looking at how others before you did it.
Sometimes it's hard not to "steal" a solution from someones work. Because almost everything has already been invented and made on md subject.
Hard times have come when it is almost impossible to be original and come up with something new.
Not today, not yesterday, but a few years earlier.
XP has made a significant and original step forward with Deus. Minelab has also made a breakthrough with multi-f.
So today it is very difficult to come up with something new and original. If not impossible.
In that sense, I would not waste too much time criticizing.
But I'm really sorry to see that Nokta/Makro has finally taken the first real steps, reached the level of knowledge that they can really make their own detector ...
and still can't get rid of childish moves.
Several of their products are pure grotesque. And then between them you see a decent detector, from time to time.
That is why I am annoyed by this lack of seriousness and not understanding the right course that they should have taken a long time ago.
And that is to focus strictly on those few good designs they have and to develop them further.
And of course to stay away from such comical and bizarre moves, which only go further to their detriment.

[Taktyk]

You justify copying Nokta 1:1 to grow their business? This is a tragedy.

We want new solutions and inspiration, not copy and aggressive marketing. And Nokta works like this, they copied and now they have a marketing message that their products are the best...
This is pathetic... I'll say it again. We want new solutions and inspiration... we don't want any more bull**** and marketing.

Why marketing says they have patents? It's a lie. Show me one. Open your mind and don't be like Nokta.

[ivconic]

You justify copying Nokta 1:1 to grow their business? This is a tragedy.

We want new solutions and inspiration, not copy and aggressive marketing. And Nokta works like this, they copied and now they have a marketing message that their products are the best...
This is pathetic... I'll say it again. We want new solutions and inspiration... we don't want any more bull**** and marketing.

Why marketing says they have patents? It's a lie. Show me one. Open your mind and don't be like Nokta.

I don't justify anything like that.
You probably missuderstood me.
It's just ...we can't claim somebody copies something without rock solid proofs.
Second; i justify only when somebdoy trace out the original and get the copy in a course of learning.
Metal detector documentation, like schematics, were always mystified and hidden from the public.
So there were no sources from where to learn, from where to see how is done.
In that case; only thing left is to dismantle the original, trace out pcb, draw it with components, than trace out the schematic from that.
And by doing that to generate the documentation for future use. Learning, experimenting and servicng other devices.
I started exactly like that, my primary motif was to have documentation to be able to service and repair detectors.
At the time; too many detectors in my country; NONE customer support. No services. No way out.
Geotech didn't existed at the time too.
How to overcome such situation? As i explained above.
Besides... this very forum, the Geotech; would not attract so many people worldwide; if there were no such works.
...
Too many claims that somebody copied somebody.
Even i did such claims in the past. But i am joking all the time like that. Provoking.
But if we want serious talking; of course i do not support stealing somebody's else intelectuall work and make money from that.
Hypocrisy is not my character feature...hopefully.

"...We want new solutions and inspiration..."

Welcome! Who is stopping you! Here is your chance, c'mon post here your new solution, inspiration and genuine ideas!

[Funfinder]

Still very amusing here but as a long time friend of Makro / Nokta I must say that I'm happy this formerly
Turkish "insider" company meanwhile has made it under the Top 6 of most wanted MD-producers.

Garrett, Minelab, Fisher, Whites, XP and Nokta (Makro).
Kellyco from Florida also lists OKM - they must be nuts to support this lousy LRL-company! Hahaha!

And when these f*** idiots (travel-restrictions and sh*t) have left the surface I will drive with the Orient Express
via Serbia to Istanbul, throw a big party and bring them my Turkey-Music-Collection as thanks for their good work.
Meanwhile you can get thousands of Turkish Lira for a few Euros so the whole trip will be a bargain, anyway! Hahaha!
And on my way back I can make a "short" stop at Nish and the nearby medical-recovery-towns with a green heart ...
I hope they have good medicine there in form of selfburned Rakiya! Hahaha!

Yeah, the Orient, what would be the world without it ?! All the great music and magic tunes - not to compare with all this
mainstream crap which overfloods the corrupt and perverted West. Treasure-hunting in Afghanistan, Egypt or Iran is also much
more romantic and adventurous than in Europe or the US. But of course you'll need a Turkish MD for that, thats clear !!! Hahaha.


Apropos West: Could it be that this monstrous Frankenstein-like gentechnical experimenting with seeds and plants leads to
Virus-mutations? Those responsible for these experiments and the greedy companies behind will pay a very painful price!!!
Eat your genetical mutated corn and croak from it, you with nature fooling around pigs! What do you think who you are?!
We know your firms and companies who do this and the devilish scum which supports you!

But I'm enjoying it that this filthy world already now is paying a huge price and suffers without any end! These beasts!
I hope it hits exaclty all those **** who deserve it while the real great people having the best time of their life now ...

But back to Makro-Nokta which are the same "brothers" as Russia and Ukraine btw. Hahaha - good luck with them...
And since I have built now even a second audio signals to vibration-unit which finally also works with the Non-Motion
Mode (beep on off audio signals) from Jeohunter and DeepHunter, I can hunt with the 1m coil which i can drag with
a plastic-rolls-cart over the fields, while listening to loud music and drink "multi-vitamine-juice" without any end! Hahaha!

Apropos Music - I saw these New Year postings - do you know the saying: "In the end always the brass-band wins!"
btw. @ ivconic, there exists a great "Trumpet VA mp3" collection - perhaps you might find it at duckduckgo-dot-com.

However, the winning-march (this pun was intended) of Makro Nokta is no longer stoppable and I'm proud that I
was (or still be?) a significant part to establish this extraordinary MDs creating company for "worldwide attention".
Which it really deserves but that doesn't mean that other MDs would be all bad or crap.
But per instance Makro-Nokta were the first in 2015 who came up with vibration and I even can no longer
remember how I was able to hunt all those years before without having great music-entertainment !!! Really!

OK, you are distracted by the surroundings, the digging and MD-signals etc. but its still a huge difference.
And without music you automatically listen to all the disturbing animal etc. noises which can make you nervous,
especially if its getting late or dark. Hahaha, sometimes foreign people stood directly in front of me in the
middle of the woods which I haven't recognized before at all - thanks to Makro Racer and 100 decibel of power-sound!

But enough Makro-Nokta smalltalk, before I regret it that I wrote here anything at all and scrub everything again.

[Funfinder]

Before I forget it:

The newest Nokta MD is called: The Legend

and has also multi-frequency which seems to defeats all the EM-noise from power-cables and high voltage lines.
I guess its also waterproof like the Anfibio but the downside is the inbuilt rechargeable battery which I hate.
It must be always be possible directly to replace the weak battery with a fresh one! But maybe you can
clip on a powerbank while the device is running, but this is not working for every digital camera etc.!
Thats why I also can't work with the XP Deus and its stupid coil accu! Sorry, but the XP is for people
who like it rather "leight-weight" and with smaller coils anyway. Otherwise the "fantastic" XP company
would have offered 40-45cm coils already since 10 years - but of course NO! And I guess this main
"smartphone"-style device of the Deus also runs on an internal rechargeable battery, totally foolish!
But I don't wanna make any trouble here - Hahaha - if someone likes the XP Deus she or he can have it - there also
exists young men who love elderly women and I am happy these cartonboxes have found someone who wants them ...
So they don't disturb me! Hahaha!
And as I have said already, I need this **** inbuilt accu-crap also NOT from Nokta-Makro! It's just unpracticable!
And after a few years - or better said exactly after around 6-7 years - you have to replace this piece of crap or you
have to throw the complete device in the bin because no longer working! Same with mp3-players.
btw. would be interesting how long all these electro-car batteries are lasting ?! For sure not as long as claimed.
Nothing than designed to fail crap like all those ATX power supplies with there fast dying electrolyte capacitors!


And also before I forget it - another coincidence I had - because I checked some older hard-drives:

Diggers.S01E02.Oregon.Trail.Mix.480p.HDTV.x264-mSD ca. 350MB in size, 25 minutes

This was from 2012-2013 around and I doubt you can find it still nowadays somewhere.
But I can upload it for you if interested - but also just because of forwarding the coincidence!
Its not directly about Oregon but about some middle west trail which leaded to there.
10 years ago I have saved all these Diggers, American Diggers, Gold Diggers etc. series.
Meanwhile everyone with a digicam and a youtube channel makes his own series! Hahaha!

[Skippy]

I realise this is off-topic, as it's not about the Invenio, but:
You can plug an external power-bank into the USB port of the Legend. Or better still, they actually manufacture a special power-bank, that is long and slim, and fits neatly under the elbow-cup. Take a look at their publicity brochures etc, you can see pictures of it.
And the Lithium battery inside the control-pod looks nothing special, just a large foil-pouch LiPo, size "906166" = 61mm x 66mm x 9mm. And the control box case seems to unscrew, it's not glued together, so it should not be too difficult or expensive to replace the battery when it fails.

[Funfinder]

Great info, thank you, and it is not offtopic cause Invenio and Legend will use pretty the same accu-managment-systems.
So this is good news because at least you have to be able to get some fresh energy directly for the MD whenever needed.

btw. do exists baseball-caps with solar-cells and inbuilt mp3-players? Hahaha! If not, it would be a nice invention idea.
With a longer cable and a larger hat you also might be able to power the MD, if it needs just some 30-50 mA per hour.


OK, this Oregon Trail coincidence turned out into a real computer-game-Treasure from 1992 which I have
installed meanwhile on my computer. You can run that game with DosBox emulator on Windows 10 etc.
Interesting because it has to do with treasure-hunting. The fertile valleys of Oregon, yeah yeah... I guess
this was rather a jumping board into the wood-resources or for heading farther north into the gold-mining.

It has become a little bit of a treasure, this game "Oregon Trail" because it is hard to find.
Type at the youtube search "oregon trail game" and you can see how it works.
And the Japanese word Sokoban correctly translated means warehouse-man or store-room-manager.
Removing and replacing something before there's no more storage-possibility left in the limited space.
Which is also important if you have boxes without any end full of rusty stuff or "treasures"... Hahaha!

I have now uploaded especially for Karl and Ivconic some zip file with: the Diggers - Oregon Trail
from 2013, the Game: Oregon Trail from 1992 and some Sokoban Games etc. But you can delete the
link because I will put it in the next post. I don't wanna have anything to do with this coincincence
any longer, thats the only reason why I did this! Take it or leave, delete it or whatever, I don't care.
Or enjoy it! Hahaha! Same as I will enjoy that rare game which I wouldn't have found otherwise!

[Funfinder]

oregon_trail_n_more.zip
328MB

Best download it as long as it exists from:
https://1fichier.com/?w0zqzfcmg0h0xmllartk

Or otherwise from some link here:
https://mir.cr/XZ6BTLWK

Enjoy and say thanks to your fate!
You would have had no other possibility anyway! Hahaha!

[Funfinder]

btw. I used this winter for a huge amount of preserving, saving and backuping of old data.
"Data mining" in the future will be not just gathering new data but also old and "lost" one.

The Makro DeepHunter-DVD from 2013 started to bend (perhaps because of the sticker -
they provided a burned DVD-R with instructions etc.) and meanwhile is just 1/4 readable.

But the more time goes by, the more data from the "good old times" will be lost, forever!
And then they will do data-treasure-hunting and all the archivers will be highly demanded.

btw. I've found "The Oregon Trail Deluxe Edition" inside a huge DOS archive called eXoDOS
and the 4 disks version I had did not work, because the data didn't fit on the floppy disks.
So you're lucky because I had the old version since years but the new just since weeks.

And I'm hoping that the software of all these new fantastic updateable MDs won't get lost
- the firmware on the programable chips - or you can use them as crooks only ... Hahaha.

It starts with the depleted rechargeable accus inside which the normal user can't or won't
fix (because too expensive, company no longer available etc.) and ends with empty chips.
For me this is no problem, I have attached a 5x larger accus to my mp3-players Hahaha,
but others could run into problems, if they are buying second hand these "modern" MDs.