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Has anyone used an X-5 and what do you think of it. I have heard a lot of good things about this detector, Dose a single 9 volt really last as long as they say. What about the deep stories. I was looking at these last weekend thinking the X-3 looked like a good basic light weight detector to get for the kids until I found out it cost over $700. I asked Troy what was so special about the electronics in these detectors and most of what I heard was medical grade surface mount technology, specially tuned filters and special silicon seal on the case. Then I heard it stated that the new model will go twice as deep as the old one, the typical salesman talk. I noticed in the pcb picture posted 12/02/03 there is a large 10uf 250v capacitor near the top center and I was wondering if this cap is across the xmit coil. It seems like a lower voltage rated cap would have been smaller and took up less space. Dose this detector have a boost power supply circuit for the xmit, I don't see any inductors on the board. Just wondering how much hype and how much reallity on performance.
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Re: Shadow X-5
I have an X5 and it is excellent. 15 to 16 inches on a quarter on an air test. It is built very solid and the controls feel high quality. I was wondering about that cap myself.
By the way the X3 is actually newer than the X5. The X5 has more than just extra controls and is deeper than the X5.
The reason it all sounds like hipe is because it is truley the best.
The single 9v will last longer than any hunt. Probably quite a few. I use a rechargeable NiMH. -
oops
I mean the X5 is deeper that the X3.
Why no edit button on this forum?
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Re: Shadow X-5
Well I have yet to hear anything bad about Troys detectors. The fact that an individual could design an analog machine that kicks but on depth and hardly uses any power while riveling the big manufacturers that have been in the bussiness for years really makes Troy a legend and an example of the American dream. I am sorry that I even questioned his detectors. But I would still like to get one and take it apart.Comment
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Re: Shadow X-5
Actually guys, the X-5 is based on a FISHER 1236 or 1266 and put in different clothes, so nothing special about that then.
Air tests don't mean squat. If coins were found in air why would I need a metal detector? the REAL test is in ground depth, and YES the X-5 has excellent depth, but it loves deep iron too.
LMAO, medical grade electronics!! Pretty much the same as military grade then. Seems to be down to the temperature range and the overall reliability. Perhaps thay should be touting NASA satellite grade rad hardened electronics, but then the machine would cost $1m. It would still go just as deep as any other machine, but be 10 times more expensive ;-)
Super silicon?? more like mil grade RTV (oh that's $5 per 250ml tube to you and me).
Trust me, there's more talent on this forum than in professional detector design in the commercial place today. At least the ppl here appreciate what CAN be done. Mfg's like Tesoro, Troy, Fisher etc are only interested in re-vamping old designs to con the public out of more hard earned cash for the same old stuff. Just look at how much alike Tesoros designs are.
Sorry guys, but more hype from a manufacturer. Lemme go get my bucket.
AH, that would be MINELAB then!!!Comment
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A few points
The 1266 is terrible in an air test. Plus the 1266 descrimination does not work to the full depth of the total depth. So I don't think they are similar machines.
I detect on beaches and the sand is close to air. I'll take the machine with the better air test. Depending on the design, if a machine does bad in air, then the ground won't help much.
I've heard the comment about iron before. Please elaborate. For example if I disc out a nail while 4 inches away, then move the nail away though the full depth, it will still be gone. The 1266 would get a response eventually as you move away.
Never tried Minelab, I'd like to though.Comment
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Re: Shadow X-5
While I agree about the constant revamp of the same machines (and often not for better) by the major manufacturers, if 'Medical Grade Electronics' means that all componants are checked and those not within a VERY narrow spec. are discarded then I would be prepared to pay a premium.
I've only tried a couple of Shadow X5's but both performed (air and ground) about the same.This could just be luck. Other manufacturers machines in the same price range varied by as much as two inches. Great if you get the hot one but not otherwise.
On the other hand there's so little in a detector compared to a portable T.V. at a tenth of the price that we should expect perfection within the limits of the initial design.Comment
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Re: A few points
Apparently Troy Galloway was not happy with my comments above.
I found out the other day, that Vic of "Red Heat" fame had something to do with the X5. Interesting as Vic's NEW machine the "Tornado" is AWESOME. I give it 100% on all counts.
It has three micros in it, but they all do what micros SHOULD do, stay invisible and do their job properly.
Re the deep iron; I have an article somewhere from a magazine that reports the problems. See the email I sent you for explanation.
I found the Minelab Sovereign excellent on the beach, but a little disappointing inland due to the constant blanking due to iron. I find it doesn't recover fast enough, so misses good targets if their next to a bad one. The Explorer doesn't have the same problem as you can set it's iron blank sensitivity. The build was a bit ropey on the MkI, but the Mk2 seems to be holding together a LOT better.
Still too much money for what it is though, and I'm sorry Minelab, but IMHO a machine is REALLY worth what it's resale value is. Look at the EX I £400 maximum on a year old machine? I certainly wouln't be happy if I'd lost £500 in one year.
Why not reduce your prices and watch the sales sky rocket?
I know Troy galloway is monitoring this post so.......
Mr. Galloway. Freedom of speech!! You have every right to reply to what I have said, it's only MY opinion and I have every right to voice it, as do you yours. This is a technical forum where people discuss the relative merits of one machine v. another. I have EVERY right to point out the negatives that I head users reporting, or would you have us "wooly" it all over for you and say that your machine is the "muts"? Sorry Troy, I won't do that. People have a right to hear it like it is, and if you don't like it then I'm sorry.
Why not put some posts on here and give us the benefit of your vast (sic) knowledge?
I would respectfully ask what are you so afraid of my opinion for? am I REALLY that important that you get that concerned? I THINK NOT!
Nice machine Troy. Overpriced though. Sorry!Comment
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Re: A few points
I still don't get what you mean by "but it loves deep iron". When I disc out an item, it is gone no matter what the distance is from the coil. Unlike the 1266. When set correctly, the disc control works as it should. Now, there could be confusion if you expect it to work like any other machine. Understanding the differences if critical. I myself was guilty of complaining about operation because I was used to Tesoro. Now the features give me a great advantage once I truly understood the X5.
For example, I could disc out beer caps if I set the disc to 3.7 to 3.8 and still get small gold. What other machine can do that? I can disc out wet sand at 4 and still get full depth on targets above salt phase. The foot print is very large. I hear good targets before I even get there. Target VCO works great, the target check is dead on, beach disc switch very handy. 15 inch depth, One 9V, feather light. And it's darn good lokin'
I have owned one for a year now and never have I felt like I paid too much. Especially when I see the detail of not only operation but the feel, look and consistancy (due to tighter tolerances most likely). The R&D must have been very costly. Now that I know the machine, I would probably pay more (you did not hear that Troy)
Feedom of speach, great thing, even when not true or uninformed, I'm all for it.Comment
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Re: Shadow X-5 questions
I have one, but haven't used it enough to form a fair opinion. Having used tone-ID detectors for a while, I've found it tough going back to non-ID machines, even though I used a 6000 for many years.
I will say that the X5 is extremely well-made, I'll give it a "10" on that. It also has good depth in air tests, but that is something that is very easy to accomplish, and I haven't tested it in bad soil.
Regarding "medical grade" components, that's a pretty meaningless term, as there is no "medical grade" -- there is standard, industrial, and mil-spec, and these mostly refer to temperature ranges and humidity tolerance. If high-quality accurate components are desired, you can easily buy 0.1% resistors and 5% caps at very little premium over standard components.
The Shadows are expensive. But, all metal detectors are expensive, at least compared to other electronics gizmos. They are, because they are ultra-low-volume products. A TV design that is sold by the millions, can spread fixed costs out a lot thinner. And Troy is at even a bigger disadvantage than other detector manufacturers, because he doesn't have a broad number of models that share the same design. Obviously, some people think his detectors are worth the price.
The couple of times I took it out, I was in a fairly trashy area, so I dug a lot of trash trying to learn target responses. Probably not a good way to start out. I will take it out again this Spring, and try a more moderate area.
- CarlComment
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Re: A few points
Yes, I agree that if you look at the tolerances then it's possible to make a machine that's a $2000 Silver Sabre Plus, and yes, it might go 3 times deeper.
If all the values are reated at 0.1%, then the price of the X5 can be justified. Will someone have a look inside on and check out the resistor and capacitor tolerances please? If ther ARE indeed 0.1% for the R's and 1% for the C's then OK I withdraw my comments, but otherwise I stand by them.
Don't forget one thing though. DIFFERENT SOILS over here in the UK to what you guys have over in the US. What works well for you guys might well suck over here.
People have been dumping X5's on the second hand market over here like old girlfriends who've got the cl*p! I had one for sale in my shop for over a month. I couldn't give it away. Funny thing was, the day after I sold it, I got at least ten calls from people wanting to buy it!
Yeah it looks good, but I'm personally not convinced. I wouldn't have one given me, but that's only MY opinion, and it the machine suits you, then that's dandy. That's why there are so many different machines on the market.
For less money I can buy a Minelab Sovereign which will walk all over any claim made for the X5 on the beach. I've proven it. Shame the Sov doesn't perform the same inland though and wiegh a ton. That's why I have 5 different machines.Comment
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Re: Selling
I have a friend that wants one if you know someone selling over there.Comment
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Re: What did I start
When I questioned this detector I really wanted to know more about the technical make up than anything. I did not mean for anyone to get stomped on. When I met Troy at the show he did not apear to be anyone who was getting fillthy rich or anything, just a normal guy. I suppose when it comes to paying the mortgage a little exagerated sales pitch dosn't hurt, I think that I have come to expect it in everything. If I had to sell something for a living I,d be livin under a bridge. But if I designed a detector that I was trying to sell and someone ask me the technical details, I would not be afraid to share them. I don't understand what all the insecurity is in this bussiness. These are not magic boxes with a top secret design.Comment
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