TESORO GOLDEN SABRE

[Max]

sweet words: IT WORKS

Thanks to you Max, you pointed me in right direction...problem was with low inductivity of TX coil I used. I hooked the tx section to RX coil and used TX as recieve coil. --> and it worked.
Voltages are: +8V / -6.2V

Can not make depth tests yet as I have to make suitable coil first, original circuit is for 12kHz - now it is running at only 5.1kHz. But the coil is good enough to test discrimination:--> it is working too

I belive it will be quite decent detector with proper coil just need some time to make it..
Any idea how many turns 12kHz Tx coil needs? Any other information on old Tesoro coils?

Big thanks also to kurtie100, his friend and original remaker of this circuit.
Project is complete with NO mistakes at all (using proper coil).

P.S. I found two versions of Golden Sabre schematic on net, use the one kurtie100 posted in this thread.

Hi Leto,
nice to ear it works ! Could be also for me another funny project to make in some spare time.

Tesoro coils : think you could use an early lobo design (dd type) params are:
(data from an old kt315 post)

rx 1.35mH 12ohm
tx 10mH 55ohm

Also concentric would be useful I think and with better pinpointing ...just is a bit more difficault to obtain and tune with existing caps values.

Best regards,
Max

[Unregistered]

Where to find those 4,7uF ?
I have 2,2uF....Is it big problem if use those instead 4,7uF.....How much it will affect signal and overall performances?

[chemelec]

Where to find those 4,7uF ?
I have 2,2uF....Is it big problem if use those instead 4,7uF.....How much it will affect signal and overall performances?

Considering the Relatively Low Frequencys involved, Just use 4.7uF Electrolytics.
Possibly Bypass each one with a Parallel 1000pF cap to Increase the High Frequency response of the Electrolytic.

Gary

[porkluvr]

Golden Sabre

Please disregard this - see next entry.

[porkluvr]

Golden Sabre schematic -

Try it again-

I had a problem with the image quality of the schematic posted above so I have posted very nice copy of a PDF that I received from Bojidar Steff (many thanks Bojidar). I included some notes covering circuit errors you guys mentioned.

I recommend to anybody who needs a working spice simulator: LTspice is infinitely cheaper than PSpice. I wish they would pay me for recommending it, but since it's free I don't foresee that happening.
http://www.linear.com/designtools/so...witchercad.jsp

It was originally designed to showcase Linear's power products, but is is good for "predicting" the operation of Tesoro's oscillators, charge pumps, integrators, sound, and etc. I can help if anybody wants to try it but gets stuck.

[Leto]

Love at first sight..

Few observations:

1.) This detector reject small iron objects when in disc. mode completly - in other words: minimum rejection level is well above nail rejection.

2.) But still objects like tin plated iron boxes are not possible to discriminate well agains other metals - so no mirracle here.

3) Notch feature is very interesting - kind of a analog accept-reject circuitry. For example I can filter (accept) ONLY my gold ring and no other metal make even a sound!!

4) Sound is really poor, it is about the same as CLIII. I belive this is the main difference between GoldenSabre and GoldenSabreII.

5) Coil. Thanks Max I also saw that KT315 post:
rx 1.35mH 12ohm
tx 10mH 55ohm
Hm - I actually made a good gimmick to reverse Tx/Rx of whites DD coil to test GoldenSabre. But still I wonder if those values are correct. Will try to hunt for best coils in OO configuration. First I need Tx for 12-15 kHz - then I'll experiment with different Rx inductances.. and post results here.
ANY IDEAS, HINTS ...

6) Ground adjust trimmer: It works perfect - I can adjust it to the worst ground ever (I have few bags of detectors-nightmare: these are from one layer of soil near iron smelting furnace we found at excavations last year).

7) About those 4.7uF caps: I use polyester (100V) but are way too big for this board - so I orderd few multilayered-ceramics probably well enough for the job.

porkluvr thanks for non-blury shematic and corrected values. These are also corrected on parts-placement (componentzijde) picture kurtie100 posted. No mistakes also on PCB - we could just wish for such complete projects like this one.

[Unregistered]

For golden sabre.
coils ca 6 mH

Open centre:

Transmit : 110 turns 22 cm. adjust with cap for 14 kHz
.25 mm wire
First rec. 18 turns 22 cm.( same size and turn direction as trans. coil)
Sec. rec. 165 turns 12 cm. in opposite turn direction as first rec. coil.
.25 mm wire
Go for ca 5 mV receive signal. ampl, rise for gold

As winding strength or size errors make a differents, you must do some adjustment for the 165 turns.
If you have to lift up the 12 cm coil to get a nulling : then you have to reduce the number of 12 cm turns.
If you have to move the 12 cm coil out of the center towards the 22 cm coil: then you have to add some 12 cm coil turns
Look at pin 7 from LF 353 for nice sinus signal, if not adjust the 15 nF cap.

If you have a much to large receive signal then you have to flip over the 12 cm receive coil.

Use graffit spray , make the receiver ground connection in the coil, this for the twisted pair effect.

Good luck.

[Leto]

even more complete...

Originally Posted by unregistered
For golden sabre.
coils ca 6 mH

Open centre:

Transmit : 110 turns 22 cm. adjust with cap for 14 kHz
.25 mm wire
First rec. 18 turns 22 cm.( same size and turn direction as trans. coil)
Sec. rec. 165 turns 12 cm. in opposite turn direction as first rec. coil.
.25 mm wire
Go for ca 5 mV receive signal. ampl, rise for gold

As winding strength or size errors make a differents, you must do some adjustment for the 165 turns.
If you have to lift up the 12 cm coil to get a nulling : then you have to reduce the number of 12 cm turns.
If you have to move the 12 cm coil out of the center towards the 22 cm coil: then you have to add some 12 cm coil turns
Look at pin 7 from LF 353 for nice sinus signal, if not adjust the 15 nF cap.

If you have a much to large receive signal then you have to flip over the 12 cm receive coil.

Use graffit spray , make the receiver ground connection in the coil, this for the twisted pair effect.

Good luck.

Thanks to unregistered!!

[ivconic]

.....


I am also finishing this Tesoro Golde Sabre...
It will be ready in few days....
If not work....than i'll mail bomb here!
Best regards!



P.S.
white powder.....white powder....white powder.....

[Geo]

I am also finishing this Tesoro Golde Sabre...
It will be ready in few days....
If not work....than i'll mail bomb here!
Best regards!



P.S.
white powder.....white powder....white powder.....

Hi Ivconic .
I believe that now you are not angry .
Now about Tesssoro Golden Sabre... why it will not work????
All tessoro are very close the same . If you make one then you have 80% of any other tessoro model. Or you know ....if you have CL3 you are again 80% close to tessoro models ..... same machines with little modifications.
Regards

[Max]

I am also finishing this Tesoro Golde Sabre...
It will be ready in few days....
If not work....than i'll mail bomb here!
Best regards!



P.S.
white powder.....white powder....white powder.....

Hi ivconic,
please let me know if there is any advantage in depth sector...respect to bandido. I think not...but who may say ?

I'm doing a DD coil at now to figure out if I can gain few cm...well at the moment I've only tx coil part and wounding rx one.

Golden-sabre seems a bit older design...cause uses older components...but notch seems a very good idea on a gold-oriented detector.

What about your bandidoII ??? Have you finished/modified it ???
It works man... but has the bad tendency to oscillate on ic5 if not properly shielded.

Geo: yes they seems really close one to another...that's why I think cutlass and bandido share same disc and geb portions. But then performances are really close too...and depends mainly on coils used.

Best regards,
Max

[Unregistered]

Golden sabre is a good detector for not to bad ground, use it with the open centre coil ca 22 cm and it has good sens. and disc . However large rusty iron is a problem ... Use it for recreation ground the notch can reject pulltaps
( and some gold rings )!

Make a bandido/ eldorado and use it with a 25 cm DD coil you get more depth, use it on farm land. use 0.30 mm wire

The coils you make are the key for more depth.Look with a scope at the signal after the firs opamp, adjust the receive coil with caps for good sinus.
For DD coils you can adjust with ferrit for ampl and with alu foil for fase shift,
experiment with it, you need a scope.

Some things for the golden : select the Z diode in the transmit circuit,
sound strange but made some differents (dont now why....), select 2n9207 in transmitter for max peak to peak transmitter voltage, use for last lm 393 the lm393AN, low offset.


Good luck

[ivconic]

Depth....who cares?


Depth...Who cares about depth? I decided to build it cose nice notch function with all sub's included....Reminds me on Sovereign a bit....although not compareable.....also i have feeling it will be much more easier to make coil for it....
About depth.....i am coinshooter mostly, i do not care about depths under 30cm in da ground...at all...trust me. Besides i am to lazy to dig more than that...Heh...
It is almost finished....just few components more to solder...I'll test it in few days and report here of course..
regards!

[ivconic]

extent...


Oh, Geo...i didnt answer you...i switched on this page first..
I dont say it will never work....just have reserve until test it...
About else, yes i agree! When you see one Tesoro - you saw them all....
Nice machines, very suitable for us amateurs to build....I gave up of Bandido for now, cose i cant find those op-amps here in my country...damn MC33...blah...and TLC...blah.....
But this one (G.Sabre) have conventional components i can find and already have so i decided to try it....
Regards Geo!

P.S.
Of course i am not angry, i never been...it was joke on other thread....
Everything in life is joke for me....only way to survive these days....

[Geo]

Oh, Geo...i didnt answer you...i switched on this page first..
I dont say it will never work....just have reserve until test it...
About else, yes i agree! When you see one Tesoro - you saw them all....
Nice machines, very suitable for us amateurs to build....I gave up of Bandido for now, cose i cant find those op-amps here in my country...damn MC33...blah...and TLC...blah.....
But this one (G.Sabre) have conventional components i can find and already have so i decided to try it....
Regards Geo!

P.S.
Of course i am not angry, i never been...it was joke on other thread....
Everything in life is joke for me....only way to survive these days....

Hi Ivconic or Ivicha (do i write it right ??)
I am very glad because it was a ....joke ....? ???, i understood something difference .
Never mind. Now do you remember ......what about this project. ..... Fisher...1266 .
My Regards