TESORO GOLDEN SABRE

[Nihil Roma Maius]

Max wrote:

Wire is wire!

Look.

There are qualities and qualities of wire! Japan Industrial Standard (JIS) are limited to metals with a purity of 99.99% (4N type) or less. There are 5N (99.999%), 6N (99.9999%), 7N (more high purity). The common actual uses is 99.9%. This appears a small difference, but in certain process is very important. There are many deffective wires. Some wires has microholes and the difference is in procedence and/or manufacturer.

[Max]

So he's trying to discredit me here

Because you start provoking first.

RObert was banned for insult to Admin. But Admin delete rapidly and few people read it. He use terms against admin as "be man", etc. Was banned before his post against admin. Don't worry, while you don't touch admin, no problem, you can post all the comics you want, and the admin permits the discredit of the forum causes by the comics.

As I see, your signature appears in each post.

If I have not patents (but there are but no international), what!!!


But I can't see your coil, I'm sure you don't start it yet!

Hi Nihil,
c'mon stop that stupid "BS war" here. Serves nothing.

Ok, you posted a picture of "IT", nice. Seems homemade.
Like Esteban's stuff (I'm not saying that was made by Esteban, or Esteban have patented, just that looks like some stuff he posted before).

The handle and box remainds me somehow at old 8mm film camera, but ,ok these are pictures, then I need some more details to understand if is just a box connected to an handle and a "directional coil-antenna" ? round plate seems same directional stuff enclosed in front of it.

These are like Dell's picture that serves nothing to understand what we are talking about:
- is it a commercial device ?
- if so what's name/brand ?
- can find a coin on surface soil from meters away ?

- most important: what's physics operating principle ? (don't talk about patented stuff -application of principle- just physics)

BTW I've enclosed coils ready (one original Tesoro). No need to wound others, same of bandidoII. I've posted some time ago, someone asked.

Best regards,
Max

[Max]

Max wrote:

Wire is wire!

Look.

There are qualities and qualities of wire! Japan Industrial Standard (JIS) are limited to metals with a purity of 99.99% (4N type) or less. There are 5N (99.999%), 6N (99.9999%), 7N (more high purity). The common actual uses is 99.9%. This appears a small difference, but in certain process is very important. There are many deffective wires. Some wires has microholes and the difference is in procedence and/or manufacturer.

Hi,
yes I know there are different!
Have you downloaded from Internet , uhm ?

Problem is that ehm don't know how to say:
anyone that saw pictures of "inside Mineoro" by Alexis could laugh at this assertion if think that you may know that people!

I'm sure you know them all! But that's my opinion.

I use also fabric new wire... but never noticed any difference in making VLF coils, all work the same also if wire is recovered from motors, relays etc.

I've beated Tesoro's original so many times with "used" wire that I laugh too for this, even not considering mineoro inside pictures.

Anyway, if you have to construct a real precision device (e.g. a magnetocardiographic coil) you need that wire you said.
But that's another story!
Or you work at NASA ?

For sure no VLF coil need that precision. You could even beat Coiltek using a solenoid wire. Every skilled homebrewer here can tell you.

Ask Ivconic if you don't belive me.

For our purposes: WIRE IS WIRE! I REPEAT SO YOU HAVE IT CLEAR!

Kind regards,
Max

[Nihil Roma Maius]

anyone that saw pictures of "inside Mineoro" by Alexis could laugh at this assertion if think that you may know that people!

I'm sure you know them all! But that's my opinion.

In the supossed case I know them, nothing to do with other kind of devices, all very different.

[ivconic]

VCO

Yes, here it is. I spend whole day experimenting with this mod.
I made small "piggy" pcb and tested it first with Pulse IB
Discriminator by Sascho. It improved it 50% and even more!
So my expectations were great with TGS!
Yes it is working with TGS, although i had to use extra J107
to trigger LM566 input. Direct connection would not be possible
due level differences. I did that during testing. A huge saturation
occured in VCO! I tried everything;diode,resistor,capacitor...nothing!
It worked,detection is audible but with a lot of noise and saturation.
So i left initial idea and decided to use cheap trick; to trigger VCO
input to gnd!!! Heh,heh,heh...showed as good solution...
Sound is high-quality,no saturations,hums...nothing. Detection rises for
5% or a bit more...There is possibility to adjust freq. and volume.
Volume should be placed on front panel, freq. as trimmer on pcb.
Treshold is very important.Should stay as preset on pcb also.
During testing i tried to add divided signal from 4024 through those 3
diodes.First all of those 3 togather,later one by one. It was interesting
to see. A lot of noise! Squeeking and scratching in all possible combinations!
It was possible to fine readjust it and find nice,clear audio...but showed
as unstable after a while? Adding serial capacitor to VCO input also gave me
a lot of fun! Police siren sound - when detecting occured! Heh,heh,heh!
Obvious,as capacitor discharge VCO is changing frequency preseted limits...
Later i abandoned that and decided to use fet as on posted schematic...
Yes, this mod upgraded TGS audio. Now it is much better,louder and adjustable.
But have to admit - i am a bit disapointed cose it worked like hell on Pulse IB
Discriminator. Same sound as on Fisher CZ5! Soft,clear with slice delay.Superb!
On TGS it remained simple...no delays...
I suspect this is more suitable on detectors with "no-motion" mode.Should be
tested on Silver Sabre in PP mode. Have hunch it will be jack pot!
Dont know what to say!? I am still searching how to mod TGS audio to look like
on damn CZ5!
Try this, you wont be disapointed at all!

[ivconic]

If you dont have 566

Huh! It seems that i found even better solution!
I was thinking to offer alteration for LM566 since
somebody noted that it is hard to find in shops.
Yes it is obsolete and rare.
So i tried to find suitable substitution.
But it turns to be also very interesting!
Voltage to frequency converter!
I havent checked it yet.First thing to do in the
morning....

[Max]

Huh! It seems that i found even better solution!
I was thinking to offer alteration for LM566 since
somebody noted that it is hard to find in shops.
Yes it is obsolete and rare.
So i tried to find suitable substitution.
But it turns to be also very interesting!
Voltage to frequency converter!
I havent checked it yet.First thing to do in the
morning....

Hi ivconic,
nice tests.

What about depth now ?

I've 566 but you are right now it's very hard to find!

I've two candidates (but maybe you already have thoughts about them):

First thing that comes to my mind is ICL8038, that is a bit expensive but that you could use to mod sound in various ways (varing e.g. wave form , can do at same time sinus, triangle and square waveforms), adjusting freq. , adj. also duty cycle.

It's still easy to find now and there are 100% compatible replacements.

Of course, is a more complex solution but could give very interesting audio, add disc informations not just as freq. variations. Don't know if worth.

Another simple that come to my mind now is the old (but good) cmos 4046 ic. Has internal VCO and you can control frequency using voltage on a vco control pin. Very cheap (0.70eur here), very good ic and really easy to find.


Best regards,
Max

[tiktak]

Hi

Hi,
I can find 4046,but can it be used?
This will be very easy to find!

[Max]

Hi,
I can find 4046,but can it be used?
This will be very easy to find!

Hi,
of course you could use it to make an audio frequency VCO, then got real voltage to freq. conversion. It's really easy to do.
It's not only an old PLL ic... it has some interesting features and VCO is one.

There is an interesting article of an homemade Tesla's coil that uses it for the 0-5 MHz range. Look at schematic.

http://www.geocities.com/tjacodesign/tesla2/tesla2.html

Of course, you can change components values to get freq. range in the audible spectrum (from 0-20KHz).

In GSabre there aren't voltage problems for its supply... where e.g. if you would put it in a bandidoII you'll have many problems due to small voltages involved on +V and -V rails.

Then you need an audio power amplifier e.g. TBA820M, LM386, LM380, even TDA2003 (10W!) etc etc or just some transistor to give an audio bost.

Kind regards,
Max

[Max]

It works, cool , even if I've messed up PCB ?

Hi all,
tested for just 30minutes (no time, DAMN!).

My actual recipe (a bit modified from original) is like this...

used (for now):

- 4xBF244B in middle section (sampler) instead of BF245C (changed pinout of to-92)
- 2xBF245C in battery checker and osc section
- 1xLF353 as preamp (but tested others)
- used 2N3904/2N3906 instead of 2N2222/2N2907
- 1xTLC2262 instead of TL062
- 1xC517 (not BC, but it's the same stuff, pinout etc)
- 1x8ohm speaker

Freq. 14.37 Khz
+V 8V (regulated by 7808 )
-V -6.12 V

Work good without any tuning! COOL!

1eur coin at 27cms in air using DD22. Pretty cool !

Really motion detector! Nice.

Weak audio... as always!

Some small "cracks" in audio with TL062, then replaced with TLC2262 cracks disappeared.

Disc work too but have no time to play with now (maybe next week).

Best regards,
Max

[Max]

FOR IVCONIC

Hi Ivconic,
read your post in the Pulse IB thread... looking at your 566 mod. , really interesting and also require just few parts to get VCO working.

Now I get my GSabre working really easy... even if not properly tuned.
Find it really stable and even sensitive without tuning at all!
Also disc seems rock solid... tested just few minutes, but I'm sure is really good.

Cause I'm very interested in Sasho's detector too, my question is:

What about depth with small (e.g. 8'') coils ?
Or put in other words, is GSabre more sensitive than PulseIB with similar dimension coil ?

Best regards and many thanks,
Max

[dino]

For Ivconic

Dear Ivconic i made my GS but i have some problems with coil numbers. By recomendation from a friend i puted 78L09 and i didnt tested it yet, but as i have seen here that results are good, 1 coin 36cm, im intersted the right cm of coils and the number of coils.
Ps:I hope you understant what i mean coz im a little bad on spelling english:P

Best regards Dino

[Nihil Roma Maius]

is it a commercial device ?
- if so what's name/brand ?
- can find a coin on surface soil from meters away ?

- most important: what's physics operating principle ? (don't talk about patented stuff -application of principle- just physics)

- Artisanal device.

- No brand. Directional metal locator.

- Yes. Must be buried for X time. 1 inch depth (2-3 years). 40-50 cm depth (100 years). Red soil (ferrous) causes diminution in range and depth.

- The same of MD: electromagnetics.

[ivconic]

...

"...What about depth with small (e.g. 8'') coils ?
Or put in other words, is GSabre more sensitive than PulseIB with similar dimension coil ? "
No, of course not. TGS is superior. But Pulse IB is quite strange yet very interesting small
detector. "Discrimination" is actually trick, using only half of signal.
Iron near "coloured" metal is more like to mask it and detector would stay silent.
Same trick i saw at Bucaneer....Yet cute and interesting.So few components...
I made it due my curiosity...
It will need extra adjustments on the ground, all "iron" signals will mask any small coloured
item...same problem was with early CScope's...
Dino, using 78L09 is bad idea! Point with 4024 was to synchronize all stages in device,that's
why they used old fashion chopper to generate negative voltage.
I tested and compared TGS with Silver Sabre (7660 as negative generator)....Of course TGS
is superior over Silver...no doubt.
Retreive original setup and find proper coil...forget about power supply mods...Wrong path!


Max, yes i know about 4046,8038,XR2206 and simillars....To complicated..I am wandering about CZ5 "sweet" audio with lasting tone, sort of delay??? How they did it? From where they took that nice tone? Looking at CZ5 schematic (Jackdetect's hand drawing) i can not manage to understand it at all???

Should i play with some extra fet's?

[ivconic]

???

"...."...What about depth with small (e.g. 8'') coils ?
Or put in other words, is GSabre more sensitive than PulseIB with similar dimension coil ?
No, of course not. TGS is superior."

YES, OF COURSE YES.TGS IS MUCH MORE SENSITIVE THAN PULSEIB!!!
How dare you to compare TGS with toy!?
Again i am very tired...dont know what reading and dont know what writing..!!?
English is not my language...so i always think on Serbian and try to answer on
English...!?
The way i put words in previous post is more like to confuse you than to answer!
Hah,hah,hah,hah!!!!
Go to sleep! Good night!