TESORO GOLDEN SABRE

[Max]

Thanks,
again Max!!!

I will try and post results!
And IVCONIC you cant tell by first sight expecialy if someone explain to you and you cant see with your eyes.Everyones misstakes.
Thank you all for the help!

p.s.If you wanna I will send you one or two!))))))

Hi tiktak,
ok I've just missed one point I've assumed you have the USA config:

The bad news:
"
This is not true for TO92, for this case the most common pinout in Europe
(BC...) is EBC but US types (as PN2222) usually have CBE and Japanese ones
(and some high power types) use BCE."

It's the so called "pn2222 madness" (I'm serious, is a big problem for massive production).

Now, the good news:
Don't worry... at least 70% of global production of PN2222 is as ON SEMI has in datasheet. I belive you have as in that datasheet. My PN2222 are all that way too. Refer to that configuration for know and, if you can, make the test Ivconic suggested to be sure(measuring hfe with multimeter).

Best regards,
Max

[tiktak]

hi

max I have only one ugly chinees multimeter here!
I will go tomorrow and buy new!Digital.
Please tell me because I have turned them allready!
Should I test!
Or I will burn something?
Thanks

[Max]

max I have only one ugly chinees multimeter here!
I will go tomorrow and buy new!Digital.
Please tell me because I have turned them allready!
Should I test!
Or I will burn something?
Thanks

Hi tiktak,
if you have PN2222 marked on the case you would be safe using on semi pinout and then orientation in the pcb. It's the PN that makes the difference (most of the times):

PN2222 USA pinout CBE
BC2222 Europe pinout EBC
C2222 Japanese pinout BCE

So the first part of the "film" say you what is it.

There is the possibility that you found PN2222 Japanese version but I think is less than 1% prob. for real. So, don't worry, you'll don't burn stuff.

Of course, if you have/can buy a multimeter with Tr test (hfe) would be better... and you'll be sure that way. Anyway, in these circuit you couldn't damage transistors e.g. reversing E and C... don't worry. Follow the PCB assembly scheme and USA-pinout.

Fact that you have already it oscillate means you are on the right way

Best regards,
Max

PS: don't turn them if they are in correct position , look at letters E B C in schema, using usa-pinout : you have to match them with pn2222 pinout (usa), DOT is E, central is B, and other side is C

[tiktak]

hi

Thanks for incoriging words MAX!
You have found it!
I have turned them and its look like they are E B C!
Because now its unstable,but the sound stops afther 3 seconds and when I have played with coils I have found point where I can detect coin!!!
So thanks!
The funniest thing is that I have fitted them first time E B C then without test turn C B E and now when I test with E B C configuration its look like its a live!!!
Thank to all and especialy to MAX!!!
I will turn attention to coil now!
See you soon!

[tiktak]

Max how much windings will be best to wind with this 0,30mm wire with IVCONICS dimensions??D=28cm dd coil?
TX? RX?
this is now TX 115 and RX 118
THANKS AGAIN MAN YOU SAVE THE DAY!!!

[tiktak]

I were just begin to loose hope!You make me very happy!

Even that its not working well yet I have noticed very /strange/ GOOD respond to coins?!?!?!
Wow!If I reach around your results I will be in the game!
This is my first "good looking PCB" and I am so happy that with your help its working!

[ivconic]

Learn...


"..Hi ivconic,
? Is it a challenge ??? .."
No, it is not. I have ...around 50 000 different transistors here...
On photo only showed my favorites (most used)..There are 2500-3000
transistors on photo only....Who wants to challenge anyway..?

"...And IVCONIC you cant tell by first sight expecialy if someone
explain to you and you cant see with your eyes.Everyones misstakes..."
Yes, i agree! As man of honor i would not back my previous words:
"If your PN2222 is different than CBE...than send it to me by mail
i will eat it infront of the camera! I swear..."
Only, no need for you to send it. I have enough here to eat!

Max:
"PN2222 USA pinout CBE
BC2222 Europe pinout EBC
C2222 Japanese pinout BCE"
Max, this is very strange!? I am Euoropean. Never used or saw any
2222 with EBC in my life!?
My favorites (and most used) are BC... ! All of them i used so far
are CBE ???!? I swear!
Except few obsolete's, out of production now... Also "BC2222" ???
I think there is no BC2222...! I never saw it!
Or C2222...?? Or 2SC2222...never saw it!

Only transistors (small signal,TO-92) i am using, with EBC are:
S9012,S9013,S9014,S9015,S9018, MPSA13,MPSA14,2N2907....!? That's all!
But...as TikTak said: "...Everyones misstakes..."
As long as man live, he learning...Today i learned much!
Thanks a lot!

Best regards!

[Geo]

The Helmet is German or Italian ?????

[nelson]

Hi Max.
Can you help me with my questions below.
Thanks

Nelson

Hey Max, about this........

Originally Posted by Max
Hi Shahab,
think that we treated before... anyway I use with success this DD.
Outer diameter of DD coil = 22cm
Wire diameter/gauge 0.25mm(30AWG) measured without varnish (0.28 with varnish)
Tx turns = 120
Rx turns = 120 (but you maybe would use a bit more 125-135)
Resistance of both around 22ohm (must be from 18 to 24ohm)

Null as well as you can... read previous posts for how to.

Then test before without shields and see how it goes... if you get e.g. 25cm for 1cm coin you are on the right way. Then add spiral of foil... as shield as described.
Fix everything in housing using epoxy.

I can detect 1eur coin at 30cm underground with that coil and bandidoII. Coil would be even better on GS.

CAN YOU POST DETAILS OF YOUR COIL, LIKE: INDUCTANCE MEASURED, RESISTANCE, INSIDE AND OUTSIDE DIAMETER.

I NEED THIS TO COMPARE MY PREVIUS COILS. REMEMBER THAT FOR A 22 CMS COILS, ON PREVIUS POST NUMBERS OF TURNS WHERE BTW 141 AND 151. MY TESTS SHOWS THAT WORKING TO GET THE CORRECT IMPEDANCE (BTW 19 AND 22 OHMS), YOU GET VERY CLOSE TO THE INDUCTANCE REQUESTED. ALSO WHEN I TAIGTH THE COILS HAS ALL KOW, THE INDUCTANCE GOES UP, SO FOR THIS I NEED TO KNOW HOW MUCH INDUCTANCE YOU GOT BEFORE YOU PLACE THE CORD, FOILS AND TAPE, AND HOW MUCH YOU GOT AFTER YOU FINISH YOUR COIL.
MY 28 CMS COILS HAVE 80 TO 85 TURNS, INNER DIAMETER IS 27.5 CMS, INDUCTANDE AROUND 5.5 mH AND AFTER I TIGHTED BTW 8 AND 9 mH AND RESISTANCE IS OK BTW 20 TO 21.6 OHMS.
SO PLEASE, LET ME KNOW THIS VITAL INFORMATION TO COMPERA MY RESULTS WITH YOURS.
REGARDS

NELSON

[ivconic]

"Kraut" !!!

German. Prevent bricks to fall on myhead!

[ivconic]

Heh,heh...!

Prevent bricks to smash my head when falling!

Heh,heh,heh...

Geo, where are you? Long time no see?

I finished 1266. It is working but erratically....it must be that transformer.
Also i dont have original quartz, so put 32kHz....Bad, very bad!

I left it in a scrap pcb's....No need any more, now we have Tesoro Golden Sabre - much better!

I was thinking to make "Light" version even more simple;

Instead those two LM308 to put one TL082, alos instead LM393 to put LM339....?

What do you think people? It will work or not?
I'll post schematic these days....

[Shahab]

Hi all

Hi Ivconic, well all must be taken with pacience and care.
We are all here experimenters hobbiest, so i take it like that. Sharing our expirencies is the only way to success and increment knolegment. Some of us can do good jobs, some others can´t do success without been suported by good people like you and other good fellows here. But to get helped, like me, you must do jobs, bulding and experimenting MD´s. I don´t agree with people that only whant to get information from us and no experimentacion or bulding any detector at all. In resume, no contribution at all. I m here to meet good people that likes same thinks like me, buldind detector, test it and have a good time searching for good stuff from the ground, etc, etc, etc.

About your 28 cms coil, mine has 27.5 cms inner diameter and now i got for TX 85 turns, 21.6 ohms of resistance and 7.8 mH. So , i hope this week to connect and try results.
May be the reazon of my wrong results is the diameter. My coil, was wound on a 28 cms diameter form, not 26.8 cms, so may be this is the problem.
Ivconic, i know that there are so many people like me, that are asking so many things about GS and the coils, but has i said, we need to learn from the master of GS ( Ivconic). You are the one that has more experimentation on this MD. Also Max is a good man that has good results with this MD and also he is a good fellow, helping us with our habbie.
Finally, i have to said that my experiencies will always be posted here to help others with it, so Ivconic and Max, please be patience that students here needs to learn from you good people. For all your support, many thanks and best regards

Sicerely

Nelson

Yes,you are right that peoples get information from you...

But i don't think that they don't want to build any

detector at all...

Do you know some peoples don't have any informations about electronics

but love it!

[Shahab]

Hush, sorry i skipped your questions... Well, about nulling;
Best way is to use oscilloscope while nulling coils.
But not necessairly. As you said; good will and milivoltemer
would do the job just fine. Connect TX coil to oscillator.
Connect RX coil to m.v.metre...Try to achieve as less as possible
voltage at RX coil as you can get. Do not worry if you cant achieve
zero voltage. In most cases it will be impossible. It showed to me
that even up to 0.1 v coil can be useable,depends of device you are
using with it. Especially Tesoro G.Sabre is very tolerant. Very good
soluted at geb and disc stages, lets you to compensate eventual loses
from coil....Thats why i prefer G.Sabre, easy to make coil for it!
But most important thing comes after...to glue or whatever, coils in
housing, so good and stiff to eleminate any eventual movements later.
Also should stuff housing with some lightly mass....I do not want to
open this subject here, already all explained in Coils forums....
Nelson, best way to check is to use IC sockets anywhere you want to
experiment with different ic's. You are in good position to see
"in vivo" and experience "live" any differences among ic's.
Just pay attention on pin assignments...Yes, you may try LM1458 instead
LF353 for example....or TL082... buyt just for comparsions...
I am not satisfied with LM1458....but TL082 works almost good as LF353?
Now back to schematic; Yes! Again i made mistake! I omited those 2 resistors!
Damn! How it is possible? I guess it was in rush...not so good with software
for schematics...Thanks Porkluvr a lot again!
OK, now, for the last time, there is absolute correct and accurate schematic!
Yes, KT315, you are right. Adding parallel 1M resistor improved audio.
Now it is loud, and no decays while detected item estranged slowly from coil!
But i got another idea! I added switch, so we can have extra mode!
Without 1M resistor included in circuitry audio level is directly dependable
of signal strenght! There is very noticeable decay dependable of relative
movements of detected item. For example; as you removing slowly coin away
from coil surface, inch by inch, audio become more weak, decays respecting
reach/range. With 1m included, audio remains unchanged.
This can be very usefull on coinshooting! First we detect coin in Decay OFF
mode (loud and clear). Than switch Decay On and try to locate coin again.
Audio level can help us to distinguish about size and depth of detected item!
Very usefull...isnt it!
Regards!

I don't know muchthings about TGS circuit...

But please wait a moment...

I think there are some ways to find best values for L & C in receiver

part.Before working with Ivconic method for nulling the coils you can do

these steps:

1.After you control power part connect TX coil to the transmitter part.

2.parallel 15nf capacitor and 1Kohm resistor and mili voltmeter to the RX

coil.

3.Put Rx coil near TX coil then increase & decrease 15nf capacitor (per step

100p or 1n) until you have highest voltage.

4.Now work with Ivconic method for nulling coils.

5.don't forget that put this new capacitor where 15n was in receiver part.


Of course you can do these steps for L in receiver part but it's easer for

15n capacitor.

[ivconic]

...

What do you think people? It will work or not?
I'll post schematic these days....

Why waiting?
Here it is!

[ivconic]

PCB?

Need one good soul to draw pcb for it!

Come to think; it is not Tesoro GS anymore!
Can i patent this!?