Lorenz...

[ivconic]

One of my friend from "company" decided to buy Lorenz DeepMax X3...
Despite all my suggestions to NOT do that he insist persistenly.
So, what the hell....it is his money ...not mine!
With all respect to Lorenz, yet i woild never waste 4000 euros for
such device.
So he asked me today to translate to him .pdf with Lorenz manual.
This is the first time i meet more detailed this machine....
While translating on Serbian i noticed few things;
No matter they refined this device...it is still same old PI...
"Discrimination" is still inaccurate at all, despite all their
claims...I dont bite this at all!
All their claims are "conditional" in manner: "...if...if...if.."
I was pretty much sceptic from the start about PI discrimination
possibilities.
The rest of the story is very well known to me. I already learned
a lot about PI detectors during last 5 years.Already made 20-30
devices so far. Last 11 devices was Delta Pulse. it showed as the
very best compromise between costs and performances...
I also mad HammerHead last year. It wont work at the time. I guess
i wasnt ready yet to make it properly. Now i am ready (i think) so
planing to make it again this winter. I saved pcb for it, it is in
good shape.
But let's return to Lorenz. i do respect it really. But i dont respect
such HUGE prices on their products.
Let's put aside its enormous power at the output. The rest is nothing
special...same old PI with some "digital" facilities...
If we put simillar output and power supply on DP or any other descent
PI, we'll gain same performances....That's why i plan to make another
HammerHead....It has a much more presets than Delta Pulse so further signal
processing could be refined a bit....and it will meet Lorenz's performances
for sure, if stronger output applied..
Of course, same presets could be applied to Delta Pulse too. It will need
another pcb for extra trimmers and components...but why all that?
Delta Pulse is already good enough.No need for further improvements, at least
big ones...
Maybe i am wrong. I will have chance to check this when my friend get Lorenz
in next month...

[ivconic]

I can metnion Pulse Star II also...What a huge disapoint it was...
We have it for 4 years in "company"....We never founded nothing valuable with it...! Iron,iron and nothing but the iron...."Discrimination" is funny...
Yet price is HUGE..!For what?
If price was 500 euros for Pulse Star II than i would not post this critics at all...
Last months it even started to produce so many false signals....Must be cable to coil...? I am to tired to waste my time with it...

So far, most beneficial detector for me was Minelab Musketeer Colt (cose i used it longer than TGSL)...and now is TGSL...With only 3 visits on terrains i collected enough items to buy new one..! That is real deal!
Of course i wont spend even a dime on new detector for a while...

Futher i am planing to buy some original Tesoros, Troy X5, and possibly Minelab Eureka or Advantage....... new PI...never!

Why am i saying this? Simply it is time to speak honestly here.For how long will big "players" take us for idiots? When they gonna stop with wild advertisments? I think never!

But those who still dreaming always have possibillity to waste big money and see reality...

[Max]

I can metnion Pulse Star II also...What a huge disapoint it was...
We have it for 4 years in "company"....We never founded nothing valuable with it...! Iron,iron and nothing but the iron...."Discrimination" is funny...
Yet price is HUGE..!For what?
If price was 500 euros for Pulse Star II than i would not post this critics at all...
Last months it even started to produce so many false signals....Must be cable to coil...? I am to tired to waste my time with it...

So far, most beneficial detector for me was Minelab Musketeer Colt (cose i used it longer than TGSL)...and now is TGSL...With only 3 visits on terrains i collected enough items to buy new one..! That is real deal!
Of course i wont spend even a dime on new detector for a while...

Futher i am planing to buy some original Tesoros, Troy X5, and possibly Minelab Eureka or Advantage....... new PI...never!

Why am i saying this? Simply it is time to speak honestly here.For how long will big "players" take us for idiots? When they gonna stop with wild advertisments? I think never!

But those who still dreaming always have possibillity to waste big money and see reality...

Hi Ivconic,
yes right. I know that some of these actually found stuff... but people having that were mostly lucky... cause no real disc could be performed in such MDs as in standard IB/VLFs.

Then you have to consider the enormous drawback of PIs on-inland sites with e.g. small object detection, I mean using small coils e.g. 4'', 8'', 10'' and the like... totally unuseful in so many sites !

I've tested many too... also commercial stuff... and found that depth PIs with e.g. rigid delay selection are absolutely no good for small items... and ones that have e.g. down adj delay small till 10-15uS are totally unuseful too cause of minerals in soil or presence of bricks , pottery and the like.

So, the best e.g. gold pi detector cannot be used inland and with small coils ! that's a comic situation... if you think of using it (after spent 2000-3000$ or more) also out of the beach!

Ridicolous claims are also funny in that !

I really appreciate people like Eric Foster that say the truth about their stuff... they say that you simply cannot use in particular conditions and the best place is the beach DOT.

The PSII is a really good machine for depth with 1m*1m or 2m*2m coils ...but be aware from using it with 8'' coil on an infested site... can make you crazy... and all the others the same!

You need to suspend coil at least at 20cm from soil if you wanna be cool with it... otherwise any kind of false from soil, hot rocks etc will enter your ears.

And also iron recovery is so much that you can build a car with all this in 10 or 15 sessions of TH.

What to say... I still await for good news about e.g. pulsedevil for reconsidering the whole PI scenario... cause otherwise I must search just on the beach (and that's not easy or good for me).

About good VLFs and small items... I've noticed that results you can reach in air with a good PI and a 8'' round monocoil you can reach the same with a 10'' DD and a very good VLF! 2'' more (for coil) is the difference in air... then detection is the same but then you have a real DISC on VLFs!

So better having 2''more coil diameter and DISC stuff, having stable working on soil, even infested... than having 2'' less for coil ...on air... and then being lost in space on "real" soil.

What do you think ?

Best regards,
Max

[ivconic]

".So better having 2''more coil diameter and DISC stuff, having stable working on soil, even infested... than having 2'' less for coil ...on air... and then being lost in space on "real" soil.

What do you think ?"

Of course i agree.

" The PSII is a really good machine for depth with 1m*1m or 2m*2m coils ...but be aware from using it with 8'' coil on an infested site... can make you crazy... and all the others the same!.."


Totally unusable. Assuming that we might be prospecting large and massive items.....than yes, it can be used. But how many sites with suvh items arround? I dont know neither one...


As you said; sand,sand,sand...PI's are for sandy beaches and nothing else..

Regards!

[michael]

Awesome PIs

Hi guys,
I saw your comments about PIs. I agree with all about such commercial PIs, but should tell one thing : there is many of awesome PIs in this world that we can't imagine.
I have seen one of them lately. it was unbelievable. what a powerful metal detector they held the coil 1 meter above the ground and walked fast on ground.
when reaching to the target place ( a medium size metal box at 3 meters depth) it gave a very clear signal as if it was at 50 cm!!!!!!!!!! it was noticeably sensitive to gold and silver.
the box was very light without any tuning pin. just 2 push-pad; one for selecting the MODE/SENS another for tuning. Of course without discrimination. it's name was MDL-8500 made in USA.
you know I have one good PI I use it either for deep searching and superficial targets.(based on using coil size) it is very reliable. I like it, but in comparison with MDL is nothing, really nothing.
Guys in USA, where are you? Can't you search for it and find the maker?
Pls don’t try in internet, find nothing. it's a kind of black-market and seemed has been made in military industries.
Before that I had heard about other brands of special PIs like : Electron, Magma-2000 (made in US army) or "Premium Power" made in Netherland. but if I hadn't seen this one, would never have believed those.

[kt315]

good bad news, ivconic. thanks. i send you a photo maybe you have seen it. from russian side of www. Koliaj and his project PI. he get these things up on surface. lorenz there? you see yourself - no

[ivconic]

MDL-8500 ...?

It would be nice if have more detailed datas..


KT315 i like those helmets..!

[joecoin]

Teknetics made a model 8500:


http://www.tekneticst2.com/home.sstg

[ivconic]

It is ordinary VLF...???


A bit off subject here or i missed something here???

[Max]

Hi,
yes there are some good... of course... sensitive and also waterproof.

They are good for depth search... but no real disc!

My real problem with all of them is that whenever you use one on inland sites you can't use with small coils... cause of false signals due to pottery and also soil itself (hot rocks)...and you have to keep coil well at good height from soil

And of course... they have no disc ! All stories about good disc and PIs !

In reality you cannot say what you'll dig before digging for real.

Are ,for me, enormous problems on real good sites where there is also iron or fragments or hot rocks and the like.

The real advantage of VLF is that if they are properly tuned they can disc out almost all small IRON stuff and all fragments... though sometimes (but it's rare) you pick up some hot rock. In that scenario I think that no PI could be used if not something with e.g. 1m*1m coil... but then you can find an iron stuff at 3 meters... that's not exactly TH... but garbage collection.

I'll be very happy if some real disc PI will be available on the market... but till now... just big claims and no reality.

Best regards,
Max

[JC1]

Eh Gads !!!

Hi Kt315,

I just noticed that stack of German helments to the right

of the photo. Whoooo what is he stepping on?? Eh Gads !!!

[JC1]

T2

Hi,

Well these are some interesting specifications, being an engineer

I understand what these numbers and things mean, but don't have

a good feel for what are "good" numbers. Many may not understand

these specs. Kinda weirdo specifications on some of these.

Read the interview, whatever.

did google search for reviews like Dave said to do.

didn't read many, this was one of the first.

http://metaldetectorreviews.net/dete...kneticst2.html

Watch the quality of build, on everybodies, if you want something

that will last.

[ivconic]

Actually this smells like Fisher spirit...Heh,heh,heh!!!!

[Kolyay.]

good bad news, ivconic. thanks. i send you a photo maybe you have seen it. from russian side of www. Koliaj and his project PI. he get these things up on surface. lorenz there? you see yourself - no

Tolik. ne nado ustraivaty pomoyku i iz etogo foruma toje! Tebe kto razreshal mou mordu zdesy vikladivaty? Gnida ti importnaya.
I proekt eto ne moy, eto Delta, kotoruyu ti lubisch wezde vikladivaty, kak svou sobstwennuyu.

[Guest]

NU HULI TI RAZORALSYA?

Tolik. ne nado ustraivaty pomoyku i iz etogo foruma toje! Tebe kto razreshal mou mordu zdesy vikladivaty? Gnida ti importnaya.
I proekt eto ne moy, eto Delta, kotoruyu ti lubisch wezde vikladivaty, kak svou sobstwennuyu.

Kolya! Vsyo zayebis! Ti ne bzdi. Ya tebe zahuyachil takuyu reklamu, a ti kak vsegda ne ponyal ni huya! Nashi mordi tut vsem do pizdi, chto tvoya, chto moya! Obe nikogo ne ebut. Glavnoye tvoy pizdatiy pribor kotoriy ischet zeleznie krishki ot golov na glubine poltora metra! Skoro budesh tolkat svoy aparat na export!