Idea for an add on for pi detector

[moodz]

Hey there's a lot of stuff out there. Take a nap for a few months and the world changes. Now I'm also wondering if someone were to retro fit an older ML like a 2200 or other cheaper model with what we're talking about here, would the TX power punch down deep enough to give more info on the RX to be processed.
My first thought is to use the TX part of the older PI to get the power out and the sound card/dsp/android processes the signal to give more target information than what is available through the RX circuit out to headphones, true or not.
Wyndham

Hi Wyndham ... IMHO retrofitting an older detector might be cumbersome and waste of good collectors item .
I think the idea that Aziz has of very small control box with tablet / iphone / android / netbook is way to go.

It is quite doable to have a bluetooth link for example. Then we would have wand and coil with very small black box and velcro small tablet to your sleeve for viewing/control and no cords

moodz

[Qiaozhi]

Hi Wyndham ... IMHO retrofitting an older detector might be cumbersome and waste of good collectors item .
I think the idea that Aziz has of very small control box with tablet / iphone / android / netbook is way to go.

It is quite doable to have a bluetooth link for example. Then we would have wand and coil with very small black box and velcro small tablet to your sleeve for viewing/control and no cords

moodz

I suspect you're planning to create a PI version of the Deus.
http://www.regton.com/deus.htm

[wyndham]

Aziz, or anyone else that can help.
let me ask a simple question. A net book and a sound card, a program that sends a signal to the sound card and out to the coil every 10-12 ms can have I believe max of 1 v. Will this be enough to get any depth and how do you get it to alternate, software?
I don't know anything about electronics and what it takes to drive a TX coil. I always thought it took a great deal of battery juice to drive that part of the circuit that's why I ask about the old ML 2200. Do you have to amplify the sound card signal after it leaves the card?
I can see, I think, that the RX signal would have to be amplifies coming back.
If someone could tell me if the software does the work or an external amplifier gets the signal deep enough to reach a target.
Sorry to be so dense, I need an amplifier for my last remaining brain cells if I want to keep them running awhile longer. Thanks again hope you can see where I'm lost.
Wyndham

[mario]

Hi Wyndham ... IMHO retrofitting an older detector might be cumbersome and waste of good collectors item .
I think the idea that Aziz has of very small control box with tablet / iphone / android / netbook is way to go.

It is quite doable to have a bluetooth link for example. Then we would have wand and coil with very small black box and velcro small tablet to your sleeve for viewing/control and no cords

moodz

I will politely disagree with you. Many detectors already have great, balanced circuits. Retrofitting them with an android/ netbook link would simply make them even better.

Aziz, or anyone else that can help.
let me ask a simple question. A net book and a sound card, a program that sends a signal to the sound card and out to the coil every 10-12 ms can have I believe max of 1 v. Will this be enough to get any depth and how do you get it to alternate, software?
I don't know anything about electronics and what it takes to drive a TX coil. I always thought it took a great deal of battery juice to drive that part of the circuit that's why I ask about the old ML 2200. Do you have to amplify the sound card signal after it leaves the card?
I can see, I think, that the RX signal would have to be amplifies coming back.
If someone could tell me if the software does the work or an external amplifier gets the signal deep enough to reach a target.
Sorry to be so dense, I need an amplifier for my last remaining brain cells if I want to keep them running awhile longer. Thanks again hope you can see where I'm lost.
Wyndham

I don't think anything that has been suggested will help the detector penetrate deeper since you're mainly interfacing to process the signal. The sound card is strictly used in the receiver end, not to transmit a signal. Once you process the signal, you can use custom software to adjust the transmit signal in order to better ground balance, effect timing settings, and/or crude discrimination.

Some one, please correct me if I'm wrong, but you will not likely get any depth if the sound card outputs a 1V to the coil.

[satdaveuk]

??? Windows is not open , simple or proven ???
GCC compiler for Linux is far and away better on Linux and I get 192 khz sampling on most sound cards .... leaves Windows in the dust plus you can strip down bootable system to fit on much less than 10 MEG flash including graphics and all dsp code. I will be swinging my coil while your xp is still booting LOL.
Cheers from moodz.

I agree use the linux its perfect for the job reminds me of the old windows95 after that it all went tits up, the Linux system is totaly free and designed by like minded engineers like us, fast effective and will do the job ten fold.
Also if you get a problem they have a tech forum just like we have here, so its happy days
All the best
Dave

[wyndham]

I will politely disagree with you. Many detectors already have great, balanced circuits. Retrofitting them with an android/ netbook link would simply make them even better.



I don't think anything that has been suggested will help the detector penetrate deeper since you're mainly interfacing to process the signal. The sound card is strictly used in the receiver end, not to transmit a signal. Once you process the signal, you can use custom software to adjust the transmit signal in order to better ground balance, effect timing settings, and/or crude discrimination.

Some one, please correct me if I'm wrong, but you will not likely get any depth if the sound card outputs a 1V to the coil.

Ok so we get back to where I came in that the RX signal was the part that looked like we can get more information out of it.
It seems to me in my naive thinking that tapping into the RX signal at the connection to a PI box might be the place to start,The closer to the raw signal the better
How strong or weak a signal can you get before it's processed in a PI at this point? If anyone knows the range of these signals it might help finding the software to deals with them
I have seen several software signal processing programs that look interesting at least to learn more about the signal.Most of these have either demo or shareware.
I guess the next question is what about the signal can tell us what metal it is we've located by some sort of visual profile????maybe and to filter out the background signal.

Hoping to hear back on this. Wyndham

[moodz]

Ok so we get back to where I came in that the RX signal was the part that looked like we can get more information out of it.
It seems to me in my naive thinking that tapping into the RX signal at the connection to a PI box might be the place to start,The closer to the raw signal the better
How strong or weak a signal can you get before it's processed in a PI at this point? If anyone knows the range of these signals it might help finding the software to deals with them
I have seen several software signal processing programs that look interesting at least to learn more about the signal.Most of these have either demo or shareware.
I guess the next question is what about the signal can tell us what metal it is we've located by some sort of visual profile????maybe and to filter out the background signal.

Hoping to hear back on this. Wyndham

No offence intended but should we be calling you Mr Up ? as in Wyndham Up ("windem up") .... your thread started with a reasonable request regarding detectors where you indicated your hearing wasn't so good. Now you are delving into issues that really if you care to read the rest of the the threads on this site have been gone over ad-infinitum. You might find that there are a number of detectors commercially available that provide visual feedback ... there are Whites detectors that will visually indicate the probable target like dime , ring etc Next you will be telling us you want the coil to double as a shovel to dig the hole with !!!! ... hey now thats a patentable idea

moodz.

[wyndham]

No offense taken,my wife says that I go in circles to get to where I'm going. We were driving to the shop the other day and something was making a high pitch noise that bothered her but I had no clue as to what she was hearing.
Several years ago when the PI detectors were new to me, I wanted to learn how they worked. I found this forum as well as several others and through the generous postings of those here I have learned much. About that time the netbooks were just coming out and i wondered if this could be integrated somehow into the PI. Since then the Android and Ipads have come out and the the CPU power has grown, so has my curiosity.
I have always been visually centered both in my profession as a potter and as an artist, so it's natural for me to focus on this sense.
I have absolutely no ability on understanding the electronic reason a series of components can come together to do what they do, but I see the end result.
I am most likely the antithesis of most here.Those here understand the exact relationship of the nature of electronics where I see vague meandering connections of ideas.
If I ever get an old or cheap PI, I'll most likely try to bench test it and take the signal from the receive coil and run it through a sound card to see that it looks like and if I find anything interesting to me, post it here and ask why and hope someone will pickup up on something and spark their interest also.
It has always intrigued me that what is not seen can be as important as what is seen. So if my questions appear as that of someone out of touch, your right.
I have read the threads, but if it's all been said why bother to to go any farther, nothing else can be learned. There's no spark of what if, and just refining what's left till we hit the wall, what's the fun in that. This is about having fun, right?
I know the rest here are light years ahead of me but I'm glad I can tag along.
Hope I'm not too big a PITA and if i am I'm truly sorry, it was never my intent.
Wyndham

[moodz]

I can see that you are a gentleman investigator Wyndham with a curiosity about how things work and that is a good thing also. Whereas your idea about connecting an old PI directly to a sound card input is a noble one .... I would not do it .... as without the correct interface circuit it will most probably destroy the input on your computer. The interface circuit will depend somewhat on the characteristics of the particular PI you have and maybe also on the type of computer you have.

Still all is not lost ... there are people here who can assist .... If you do get a PI ....learn to use it ... learn how it works ... then make it better.

Kind regards,

moodz.

[mario]

No offense taken,my wife says that I go in circles to get to where I'm going. We were driving to the shop the other day and something was making a high pitch noise that bothered her but I had no clue as to what she was hearing.
Several years ago when the PI detectors were new to me, I wanted to learn how they worked. I found this forum as well as several others and through the generous postings of those here I have learned much. About that time the netbooks were just coming out and i wondered if this could be integrated somehow into the PI. Since then the Android and Ipads have come out and the the CPU power has grown, so has my curiosity.
I have always been visually centered both in my profession as a potter and as an artist, so it's natural for me to focus on this sense.
I have absolutely no ability on understanding the electronic reason a series of components can come together to do what they do, but I see the end result.
I am most likely the antithesis of most here.Those here understand the exact relationship of the nature of electronics where I see vague meandering connections of ideas.
If I ever get an old or cheap PI, I'll most likely try to bench test it and take the signal from the receive coil and run it through a sound card to see that it looks like and if I find anything interesting to me, post it here and ask why and hope someone will pickup up on something and spark their interest also.
It has always intrigued me that what is not seen can be as important as what is seen. So if my questions appear as that of someone out of touch, your right.
I have read the threads, but if it's all been said why bother to to go any farther, nothing else can be learned. There's no spark of what if, and just refining what's left till we hit the wall, what's the fun in that. This is about having fun, right?
I know the rest here are light years ahead of me but I'm glad I can tag along.
Hope I'm not too big a PITA and if i am I'm truly sorry, it was never my intent.
Wyndham

Wyndham,

This site has matured considerably since years past. You don't only have the support of the many knowledgeable members, but also have the schematics of several potent designs.

Some exclusive detectors are now within reach of the average user, which I think is great.

So many amazing discoveries have already been made in places like Europe, yet so many more discoveries remain to be made . I remember reading an article not so long ago about a British horde of axes discovered from the bronze age. I thought, wow, had it not been for the lucky detectorist, this stash would have remained buried for who knows how many other millennia. The more people pickup metal detecting, the better.

To you, I say, don't wait to purchase a cheap detector, get yourself a soldering iron, a PCB from one of the many existing projects and solder away. PI tech remains at a premium so you are not likely to get what you pay for.

[wyndham]

I have emailed the fellow in England that has the long board PI kit but have not heard from him yet. I think this will be the simplest least expensive way to get in game. A soon as I get one i can see what gives. I have a roll of litz wire from years ago when I was learning about PI coils as well as some others sources for other coil wire.
Thanks Wyndham

[Qiaozhi]

I have emailed the fellow in England that has the long board PI kit but have not heard from him yet. I think this will be the simplest least expensive way to get in game. A soon as I get one i can see what gives. I have a roll of litz wire from years ago when I was learning about PI coils as well as some others sources for other coil wire.
Thanks Wyndham

Why don't you just go to Silverdog's website and order it from there directly?
http://www.silverdog.co.uk/shop/inde...&product_id=76

[mario]

Hello guys, I found the site I mentioned earlier. Lots of interesting projects there about Scopes. Some DIY: http://www.gabotronics.com/resources...illoscopes.htm

[Alexismex]

Thank you Mario , good info for digital osc.

[WM6]

Great list.

Additional comment:

Avoid digital scope which do not offer FFT (frequency spectrum analyser), do not worth its money.